I would just leave and solve an interesting problem at another company. You have a large chunk of equity. Unless you want recognition - that's a different topic.
Ask HN: What's left for early startup engineers as the company grows?
141–150 of 193 posts
Re: Ask HN: What's left for early startup engineers as the company grows?
#142Earlier quoted context omitted.
It took me awhile to realize that management is, generally, not a skilled profession. Not saying that certain skills can make you better or worse at it, but that you don't need them to be effective. In a skilled profession, not having them means all the difference. You can't wire up a house without the skills. You can't build a web app without knowing a whole lot of stuff, at least not within any time frame someone w…
I quibble with your stating that you can be a manager without some critical skills. I think the skills defined under the (now defunct) concept of emotional intelligence are vital to being a successful manger. Without empathic skills you can't get anyone, but the most committed employees to perform well. It seems self-evident, but many people I've met including very poor supervisors lack the ability to really put them…
one question, why do you say that the concept of emotional intelligence went south?
Re: Ask HN: What's left for early startup engineers as the company grows?
#143Earlier quoted context omitted.
I don't understand why this attitude is a problem in this context. It's their last and only pressure point in the political game that happens in the company. If you don't feel that your skills are fairly compensated and you can't leave (due to contracting or vesting time) you don't have any other options.
Being a dick is not an option or a negotiation tactic, it is just that being a dick. Note I'm speaking to my experience, where tbe people in question do everything but actively sabotage the CTO in question.
"Being a dick is not an option or a negotiation tactic"
I disagree. Leaving is not "being a dick", it's looking out for yourself. If you don't, nobody else will. It's apparent this is the case with the OP: He was pretty much built the entire company up and was there for the company when they needed him (I would imagine late hours, weekends, etc).
Now that they don't need him anymore, they pushed him off to the side. I've heard this story 1000 times and experienced it first-hand.
I don't work for startups for exactly this reason. If I'm spending my life building your company, I better be getting 50% in equity. It's really not worth the fooseball table in the lunch room and the Red Bull in the fridge. This is why you need to get the young and naive to fill these roles.
Re: Ask HN: What's left for early startup engineers as the company grows?
#144I see a number of posts saying that you're probably not experienced or qualified enough to hold these other positions. However, I don't think the VP of Eng, Dev Mgr, or OPS Mgr could do what you do...essentially help start and build a company from day one. Those skills you've developed don't have much value at your current company any longer. They are most likely keeping you around for historical value and once the s…
The rub is:
* the OP will need to pay a lot to buy their vested options when they leave each company
* the fair market value of common stock will have probably increased so they'll also need to pay immediate income tax on every gain
* they likely won't have a market for their shares until acquisition or IPO (five to ten to never years)
* the shares they do have will be diluted 10x or more through Series A/B through F, and they won't benefit from readjusted new 4-year-vesting grants
* they'll learn a lot and profit little from serial startup monogamy
Re: Ask HN: What's left for early startup engineers as the company grows?
#145Earlier quoted context omitted.
That sounds good too, but aren't you presupposing that this course of things is normal. The OP is saying things turned out differently than expected, and such dissonance really bugs him. Why would he work harder to communicate when working hard has failed so poorly in the past? Second and third world people probably have similar problems too.
In my experience, what other people thought you communicated and what you thought communicated are often very far apart. Its an amazing thing, Humans are so good at communication but also so bad. I know with my significant other multiple times we have both got upset with each other for actions/inaction that we thought we had communicated with the other, when either we hadnt or hadnt clearly. We have been together for…
Re: Ask HN: What's left for early startup engineers as the company grows?
#146Let me tell you the blatant truth which no founder will tell you: You are just a worker bee for them. They will do whatever it takes for the startup to be successful. So even if you gave your blood and sweat, and single-handedly built the product in the last 2 years, if they think (I should underline they think) that a vp of engineering will do a better job than you - then they will go out, hire that person and probably give them more equity than you.
You should think about what's best for you next. If you think you are not going anywhere, you should cash out and leave.
Re: Ask HN: What's left for early startup engineers as the company grows?
#147Earlier quoted context omitted.
Being a dick is not an option or a negotiation tactic, it is just that being a dick. Note I'm speaking to my experience, where tbe people in question do everything but actively sabotage the CTO in question.
"Being a dick is not an option or a negotiation tactic" I disagree. Leaving is not "being a dick", it's looking out for yourself. If you don't, nobody else will. It's apparent this is the case with the OP: He was pretty much built the entire company up and was there for the company when they needed him (I would imagine late hours, weekends, etc). Now that they don't need him anymore, they pushed him off to the side.…
I agree, leaving is not being a dick. Staying and not helping, or actively hindering new staff through lies and misdirection about implementation details of a complex application in a complicated domain is.
Re: Ask HN: What's left for early startup engineers as the company grows?
#148Earlier quoted context omitted.
It took me awhile to realize that management is, generally, not a skilled profession. Not saying that certain skills can make you better or worse at it, but that you don't need them to be effective. In a skilled profession, not having them means all the difference. You can't wire up a house without the skills. You can't build a web app without knowing a whole lot of stuff, at least not within any time frame someone w…
I quibble with your stating that you can be a manager without some critical skills. I think the skills defined under the (now defunct) concept of emotional intelligence are vital to being a successful manger. Without empathic skills you can't get anyone, but the most committed employees to perform well. It seems self-evident, but many people I've met including very poor supervisors lack the ability to really put them…
> I quibble with your stating that you can be a manager without some critical skills.
Why couldn't you? All that would need to happen is a company asks you to take on the role.
Re: Ask HN: What's left for early startup engineers as the company grows?
#149Shoot me an email (it's in my profile), I can share my experience with this in private.
Re: Ask HN: What's left for early startup engineers as the company grows?
#150I see a number of posts saying that you're probably not experienced or qualified enough to hold these other positions. However, I don't think the VP of Eng, Dev Mgr, or OPS Mgr could do what you do...essentially help start and build a company from day one. Those skills you've developed don't have much value at your current company any longer. They are most likely keeping you around for historical value and once the s…
+1, witness how the company needs changed from generalists to specialists.
The experience is probably quite frustrating since every specialist they hire is supposed to handle their aspect of specialization better than you (otherwise why hire them?) - the support manager probably has better and more complicated pipelines for support, the ops guy probably owns various issues that were put on the backburner before.
Wrong way to think about it is try to squeeze yourself into a specialist position, and then keep wondering how did things get to be so bad.
Some right ways to think about it would include addressing some areas where specialization is missing (research? next-gen architectures?) or just moving on (to a different place).