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Ask HN: Is it possible to have a structured work day in software dev?

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141–150 of 151 posts

Re: Ask HN: Is it possible to have a structured work day in software dev?

#141
I have only ever done sane hours. No oncall or late nights as the normal. You need a company that is not too international and has good ops and treats root causes of outages not just symptoms.

Coincidentally I have zero experience with microservices. Might be just a coincidence.

Re: Ask HN: Is it possible to have a structured work day in software dev?

#142

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is assuming it's easy to find a new job, I don't think it's all that easy right now.

I'm hiring developers in Georgia (Europe) and Germany right now! No US at the moment though. And there will be others, especially in Europe that have trouble hiring new developers. Out of interest, why do you feel it would be difficult right now, wherever you're from?

Because many nations are facing a recession? There is a war in Europe? Soaring interest rates?

I don't want to be condescending but as someone who is hiring, I find it unusual you're not aware of looming economic slowdown?

I'm also starting a company now, but I'm definitely not hiring or spending much money at the moment until the outlook improves. Maybe you will get lucky and coast through it but I'd do some research.

Re: Ask HN: Is it possible to have a structured work day in software dev?

#143

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I work remotely from New Zealand for a company in Ireland I altered my work hours to 3AM to 12 noon. It is amazing. I catch everyone in the office at the end of the day for meetings. I pick up and finish and work they need done, I get 3-4 hours of deep work every day when they are all gone. And then I finish at noon, so I can go exercise and enjoy the day working on my startup. Bed at 6PM to wake up at 3AM

This schedule may work if you have no other obligations. But it won’t work for a lot of people.

Yeah kids will f** that schedule completely.

Re: Ask HN: Is it possible to have a structured work day in software dev?

#144

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm hiring developers in Georgia (Europe) and Germany right now! No US at the moment though. And there will be others, especially in Europe that have trouble hiring new developers. Out of interest, why do you feel it would be difficult right now, wherever you're from?

Because many nations are facing a recession? There is a war in Europe? Soaring interest rates? I don't want to be condescending but as someone who is hiring, I find it unusual you're not aware of looming economic slowdown? I'm also starting a company now, but I'm definitely not hiring or spending much money at the moment until the outlook improves. Maybe you will get lucky and coast through it but I'd do some researc…

You are condescending, even without your straw man disclaimer ...

As if I don't know what's going on around me? Weird take. There are still enough positions, especially in the IT sector in Germany, where we don't have enough applicants or employees for (sorry, don't know how to phrase it better). The IT sector is a major economic factor, overall and especially for a lot of companies. ESPECIALLY in economically hard times. Sure, hiring will slow, but just because in the US there are lots of big IT companies having big lay-offs, don't assume it's the same in other countries.

Have a look: https://sifted.eu/articles/startup-tech-company-layoffs/

Companies that are laying off are the ones that have been dysfunctional anyway or have only been able to operate because of peculiar circumstances (Gorillas, Getir) and don't have a viable business cases.

We both don't know how it will be, but I personally really need those people. We are pre-market, we have enough funding and runway. I know what I'm doing. Also, it really depends on the company and the sector. At any given time, I guess at least a few companies will do good and can hire people. We're one of those.

All the best with your company.

/e: ok, found what I was looking for: https://www.ifo.de/en/press-release/2022-08-02/shortage-skil... This is especially dire for any IT related positions.

Re: Ask HN: Is it possible to have a structured work day in software dev?

#145

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Because many nations are facing a recession? There is a war in Europe? Soaring interest rates? I don't want to be condescending but as someone who is hiring, I find it unusual you're not aware of looming economic slowdown? I'm also starting a company now, but I'm definitely not hiring or spending much money at the moment until the outlook improves. Maybe you will get lucky and coast through it but I'd do some researc…

You are condescending, even without your straw man disclaimer ... As if I don't know what's going on around me? Weird take. There are still enough positions, especially in the IT sector in Germany, where we don't have enough applicants or employees for (sorry, don't know how to phrase it better). The IT sector is a major economic factor, overall and especially for a lot of companies. ESPECIALLY in economically hard t…

I was coming from a place of concern, sorry if it came across in the wrong way. I'm glad you have funding etc, good luck to you too.

Re: Ask HN: Is it possible to have a structured work day in software dev?

#146
post #118

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Ok, that's all pretty subjective. I said in another comment, If you were a police officer, pilot, truck driver, deep sea diver or in numerous other professions, you'd be expected to do some weird hours and have a lot of time away from home. This is where I think people are being unreasonable. Remote work, we have it better than ever, no commutes, no time away from family, almost non-inconvenience but now, even a late…

Meeting ending at 00:00 means you go to sleep at 01:00 or so. That may be fine if you can sleep on till 9:00. But if the rest of the house wakes up at 6:30 to make their schedule… you’re in for a trouble.

That's true, it's not a good situation to be in that one having been through it myself, also someone who has had my fair share of insomnia.

Staying at peoples houses who get up early and make a lot of noise after a hard night falling asleep is never much fun.

A lot of good points on this thread, and even though I've always advocated for doing more async work within our team, I'll push a bit harder now.

Re: Ask HN: Is it possible to have a structured work day in software dev?

#148
post #9

Your company is badly managed. Mine also has international teams across the globe and we don't regularly have meetings at unreasonable hours (except for employees in India) This is done by not expecting managers in Europe to manage day to day work going on in Asia, etc. Your company doesn't value your well being and you should leave.

As a Software Dev in India, we are always screwed with unreasonable work timings working for local or international companies

Re: Ask HN: Is it possible to have a structured work day in software dev?

#149

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I work remotely from New Zealand for a company in Ireland I altered my work hours to 3AM to 12 noon. It is amazing. I catch everyone in the office at the end of the day for meetings. I pick up and finish and work they need done, I get 3-4 hours of deep work every day when they are all gone. And then I finish at noon, so I can go exercise and enjoy the day working on my startup. Bed at 6PM to wake up at 3AM

This schedule may work if you have no other obligations. But it won’t work for a lot of people.

Not to mention the biological fuckery of trying to maintain those hours

Re: Ask HN: Is it possible to have a structured work day in software dev?

#150
What you are experiencing is not normal development culture. It is common, yes, but normal or healthy.

It sounds like you're working with a bunch of workaholics who don't mind working outside normal hours and built a company culture around that expectation.

I work with colleagues around the world and we stay disciplined within good parts of the day and using async communication for everything else. It's not hard to do at all, but it does mean the workaholic upper management folks need to exercise self restraint and patience when scheduling meetings.

You can try setting more strict boundaries for your work hours. It may or may not work. You might be seen as lazy or not a team player. In that case, the honest truth is that you're in a toxic workplace.

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