Live data from Hacker News

Ask HN: What happens next after a successful lockdown?

news.ycombinator.com

141–150 of 211 posts

Re: Ask HN: What happens next after a successful lockdown?

#142
post #73
post #12

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Or just watch this video https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YfsdJGj3-jM

This is a really interesting video. I'm not sure how accurately it represents the situation on the ground in China, of course. But the video shows a society with temperature checks at every place of business, a location-tracking system, an isolation system, and a number of other precautions. It's a picture of a society on a war footing, certainly. But people aren't locked in their apartments, and the hospital system…

People actually were locked in their apartment compounds for about a month, at least in Beijing.

Re: Ask HN: What happens next after a successful lockdown?

#143

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Except that CDC disagrees: Herpes: https://www.cdc.gov/std/herpes/treatment.htm Is there a cure or treatment for herpes? There is no cure for herpes. Antiviral medications can, however, prevent or shorten outbreaks during the period of time the person takes the medication. In addition, daily suppressive therapy (i.e. daily use of antiviral medication) for herpes can reduce the likelihood of transmission to partners.…

> During the 2018 eastern Democratic Republic of the Congo outbreak, four investigational treatments were initially available to treat patients with confirmed Ebola. For two of those treatments, called regeneron (REGN-EB3) and mAb114, overall survival was much higher. These two antiviral drugs currently remain in use for patients with confirmed Ebola. How is this not a cure? If you mean that the cure doesn't save 100…

Ebola fatality rate ranges between 25-100%. The only thing that we have as the data is that with these two drugs the fatality rate might be less than 100%. Because Ebola is extremely aggressive and is largely contained to isolated areas its carriers tend to die and everything those people were in contact with is destroyed. Same goes for patients that contract Ebola and recover. That was the protocol for EVD outbreak in West Africa 2014-2016. That's what allowed us to "handle" the issue.

It certainly does not appear that COVID-19 has a similar protocol, at which point we are in herpes territory of managing disease rather than curing it. I find it very strange that this is not being addressed.

Re: Ask HN: What happens next after a successful lockdown?

#144

Earlier quoted context omitted.

They are suppressors of symptoms/disease management helpers not cures. Ebola patients either die or their immune system fights off the disease.

Isn't this similar to a typical antibiotics regimen? The abx kill a lot of bacteria with an X-log reduction and the immune system takes out what's left? I'm not an expert on this, just curious.

Antibiotics target bacteria. We have been successfully killing bacteria ever since the invention of penicillin.

The rule of the thumb is "prevent viral infections via vaccinations because they cannot be treated" and "treat bacterial infections using antibiotics because they cannot be prevented"

Re: Ask HN: What happens next after a successful lockdown?

#145
post #12
post #9

I thought this interview was illuminating for post-lockdown life in China https://twitter.com/MikeIsaac/status/1238604080571772928?s=2... It shows just how far behind we are. TLDW: Temperature checks everywhere. Fever clinics optimized for quarantining the potentially infected. China is trying to actually contain the virus. The only way out for us unless we significantly ramp up testing and lockdown is to admit defea…

Or just watch this video https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YfsdJGj3-jM

I live in Beijing and came back early Feb after the new year holiday. We’re doing all that stuff too, even the single use tissue in the elevators.

The day after I got back we found out we had a case of covid-19 in our apartment block, so we were one of the first to get restricted entry/exit — each unit gets 2 cards and you have to present it when you enter or leave through the single open gate. I did 2 weeks going outside just twice to buy food, then slowly relaxed a bit. Many of my chinese friends are still basically not going out at all.

Now’s an exciting time for China because we’re at basically zero new cases in the country (had 4 new ones in Hubei yesterday, the rest were all retournees from outside the country). So since yesterday, it’s mandatory hotel quarantine for everyone who enters the country.

Really getting worried for my family and friends in the states though. Gonna have some long talks about how to prepare.

Re: Ask HN: What happens next after a successful lockdown?

#146

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Corona viruses are not “the cold.” Rhinovirus causes the common cold and corona viruses cause 10% of cold cases. Just like other corona viruses, they make a recurring appearance. But this is not because they mutate in the way the flu does. No corona viruses mutate in the way that the flu does. If you have some evidence to prove me wrong then produce it. You definitely develop immunity to viruses that sicken you. For…

> If there is a second wave it will only be because of overly aggressive quarantining. Common cold causing coronaviruses have recurring waves every 2-4 years. If they don't mutate like flu it means that immunity is not that long lasting.

No, it doesn’t necessarily mean that. If you find a paper or expert testimony that totally unambiguously shows that I’m wrong, I will totally retract what I’ve said.

Re: Ask HN: What happens next after a successful lockdown?

#147
post #5

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> The endgame is to figure out the least cost sustainable measures of getting R0 The question assumes this has already been done: "single cases here and there, maybe even 0 cases". It seems to me that the key question at that point is, if there are no active cases--everyone exposed to the virus who is still alive has either never developed symptoms in the first place, or has recovered from whatever symptoms they had…

It does not assume that - Wuhan currently has R0<1 and it did not and still does not have "single cases here and there, maybe even 0 cases"; R0<1 through a lockdown is a tested (in Wuhan) way to get from tens of thousands of cases to just tens of new cases per day and probably eventually to single isolated cases here and there. But we'd really like to find a less invasive, more sustainable set measures than what was…

> Wuhan currently has R0

You're missing my point. I'm not saying that R0<1 implies "single cases here and there, maybe even 0 cases". I'm saying the converse: that "single cases here and there, maybe 0 cases" implies R0<1. Which is obviously true. And the scenario posed in this "Ask HN" question assumed "single cases here and there, maybe 0 cases", so if that implies R0<1, and it does, then the OP's scenario does assume R0<1, even though it doesn't say so explicitly.

Re: Ask HN: What happens next after a successful lockdown?

#148
post #56

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Total quarantine isn't happening in any western country

That is not correct for some days now. Many other countries in EU have entered a state of emergency with various levels of quarantine at national level: Italy (but that's old news), Spain, France, Belgium, Estonia etc. None as extreme as China, but measures are intensifying gradually. In Czech Republic, only essential businesses are allowed to function, although the measures are not as extreme as they were in China.…

Yet here in Australia schools and businesses are still open and everyone is still cramming into public transport.

Nothing to see here, move along...

It could have something to do with the fact our Prime Minister is a raging prosperity cultist, eagerly anticipating the rapture, and attended a 3000 person cult rally only two days ago.

Coincidentally, 500 person gatherings were finally banned the day after their big rally.

Re: Ask HN: What happens next after a successful lockdown?

#149
post #59

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Do you have a reference for that as I keep hearing it repeated but I'm yet to see any real evidence for it.

I’m not OP, just a concerned parent who is trying to figure things out. I have not been able to locate a single scientific study about this. Rather, the evidence all seems to be news reports of people testing positive, then negative and then positive again. Since it isn’t scientific, all the usual caveats apply - we don’t know much about how effective those tests were and again, these are news reports. If you’re inte…

The truth is that these current tests (rt RT-PCR) are not completely accurate and may only have a true positive rate of 60-70%. See Discussion section of: https://pubs.rsna.org/doi/10.1148/radiol.2020200642

Additionally, people who are asymptomatic can test negative on all of their tests and only be diagnosed via other means. See Figure 1 here: https://link.springer.com/content/pdf/10.1007/s11427-020-166...

Re: Ask HN: What happens next after a successful lockdown?

#150
post #127

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Looking at the people happily strolling around and gathering in public cafes as if nothing was going on, I severely doubt it. (large city in Germany btw)

Those Darwin award winners will be the first to get it.

How does that work? Killing the elderly reduces the support network available to rear your children, and so reduces your ability to sustain your genes?
Post reply on HN