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Ask HN: How would you bootstrap a space company?

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Re: Ask HN: How would you bootstrap a space company?

#141

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It was kind of a joke but come on, Arianespace's leaders have been pretty salty about SpaceX in public so clearly there is some jealousy. And as I understand it most of the oldspace launch providers aren't significantly cheaper than SpaceX even if latter operate their rockets in expendable mode.

True that! The one thing that really sets SpaceX and Ariane Space apart if development. Less the capabilities but more the amount of politics and red tape. In that area SpaceX has a clear advantage.

I really wish Arianespace were smashing it like SpaceX. No doubt they have great engineers, if they could just be let off the leash a little.

Re: Ask HN: How would you bootstrap a space company?

#142

NOTE: The below suggestion is assuming Starship pans out and launch costs drop dramatically. The way I see it, there are 3 (overlapping?) ways of making money in space: 1) put something up there (like a satellite) 2) take something down (asteroid mining, space based manufacturing, etc) 3) do something in space you can only do there Here's an idea that falls into category 3 that I've been kicking around - space based…

The enemy's gate is down.

Re: Ask HN: How would you bootstrap a space company?

#143

Figure out a way to make LOX cheaper than anyone else on an industrial scale. I bet LOX production is a pretty sleepy business with few competitors. Use the money selling LOX to bootstrap the space business.

Now that's an interesting idea. Granted I have no idea how competitive/costly this market it, but I didn't think LOX was that expensive to begin with in comparison to other costs in aerospace.

Re: Ask HN: How would you bootstrap a space company?

#144
post #131

Earlier quoted context omitted.

But if you are someone like lockhead you have money to wait for spacex to fizzle out, headhunt their talent, and outperform with your military industrial complex connections and 70 years of working in aerospace.

Yeah, just like Ford and GM waited out Tesla to fail... (and SpaceX is profitable as opposed to Tesla)

Tesla made a profit of $143 million in Q3 2019 on record deliveries

https://arstechnica.com/cars/2019/10/tesla-made-a-profit-of-...

Re: Ask HN: How would you bootstrap a space company?

#145

NOTE: The below suggestion is assuming Starship pans out and launch costs drop dramatically. The way I see it, there are 3 (overlapping?) ways of making money in space: 1) put something up there (like a satellite) 2) take something down (asteroid mining, space based manufacturing, etc) 3) do something in space you can only do there Here's an idea that falls into category 3 that I've been kicking around - space based…

The enemy's gate is down.

Exactly. I think Ender's Game is what got me thinking along these lines.

Re: Ask HN: How would you bootstrap a space company?

#146

Figure out a way to make LOX cheaper than anyone else on an industrial scale. I bet LOX production is a pretty sleepy business with few competitors. Use the money selling LOX to bootstrap the space business.

Now that's an interesting idea. Granted I have no idea how competitive/costly this market it, but I didn't think LOX was that expensive to begin with in comparison to other costs in aerospace.

per Musk fuel/oxidizer costs make up the bulk of launch expense. If you could save launch providers 2% on LOX with equal service they'd buy it in a heart beat. It's like going to the next gas station to save $0.10/gallon gas. Granted your competition may just say, "ok now we'll sell at a 5% discount". Of course the devil is in the details, it may take hundreds of thousands of dollars in permits to transport it. Maybe you could invent a popup LOX processor like those popup concrete factories near big construction projects. That would be pretty cool.

Re: Ask HN: How would you bootstrap a space company?

#147

Here's some different resources that might help you tap into the entrepreneurial space community as well as help get you bootstrap, seed funding for your space business: - The New Space Conference ( https://spacefrontier.org/newspace2019/ ), which alternates between being based in the Bay Area and Seattle. This conference is a great, accessible way to find out what is going on with startup companies attempting to do…

Wow! I've been watching various SBIRs this year with a buddy, but have never heard of some of these programs. Muchas gracias!

Yeah, there's alot of niche programs that can provide nice amounts of seed space capital without being a billionaire, it's just they are fairly in the weeds and a bit hidden.

Re: Ask HN: How would you bootstrap a space company?

#148

I've worked in aerospace and have been reading HN for over a decade. Here's some adult advice, for both the OP and HN in general. Space is a waste of time unless you're a government or a bored billionaire. Objects are too far, and lift is now a commodity. (SpaceX will probably end up shutting down due to lack of lift demand, hence their polluting the sky with micro satellites now.) So if you really want a career in s…

Boo, this is unnecessarily negative. Here's some cool things that are happening in entrepreneurial space.

First, SpaceX is using its reusable launch capacity combined with the StarLink constellation to dramatically lower launch costs over the next decade. Here's a nice writeup on why StarLink is important (https://caseyhandmer.wordpress.com/2019/11/02/starlink-is-a-...). SpaceX is essentially using StarLink to 'soak up' all the extra, cheap launch capacity it will produce (demand generation) until the rest of the industry wakes up to this new reality. This will help SpaceX both produce fantastic profits to fund capital investments for space endeavors while also increasing the heavy launch capacity possible to space, vastly increasing commercial opportunities in the 2020s.

Another healthy space area has been nanosats and cubesats. Nanoracks (http://nanoracks.com/) has created a healthy business out of the ISS launching these, while Planet Labs (https://www.planet.com/) has created a near-earth observation constellation that is commercially doing well using these kinds of platforms. Small launch providers for nanosats and cubesats, as well as a healthy diverse ecosystem of hardware suppliers (https://blog.bliley.com/top-20-best-cubesat-satellite-manufa...), has made this an accessible area of space.

Space-based manufacturing has indeed been slower to launch. The Space Shuttle did pioneering work in showing that fiber-optic cables based on something called ZBLAN could be produced in orbit (https://upward.issnationallab.org/the-race-to-manufacture-zb...), and they are an ideal space-based manufacturing product: they are straightforward to produce in orbit, can fetch a very large price, and have a very small downmass back to earth. Made in Space has done recent pioneering work demonstrating producing ZBLAN in space (https://madeinspace.us/capabilities-and-technology/fiber-opt...). Here's a great list of other startup companies pushing forward with space based manufacturing: https://www.factoriesinspace.com/manufacturing-companies

One of the most exciting developments is Made in Space's Archinaut project (https://madeinspace.us/capabilities-and-technology/archinaut...), which promises IMHO to allow us to build complex structures in space from small-fairing rockets. Significantly, NASA recently gave a large grant to Made in Space for an Archinaut demonstrator mission in the near future (https://www.engineering.com/AdvancedManufacturing/ArticleID/...).

Not to be crass, but the last thing we need are cynical old economy space folks who have given up on moving space forward. There is a diverse, vibrant space economy under the surface if you know where to look; it's not Apollo or O'Neill cylinders (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/O%27Neill_cylinder) in space but real companies that make real profit and move humanity forward have been quietly working behind the scenes the last two decades. Much of this is due to low-cost launch, more accessible satellite platforms like cube and nano-sats, and a NASA that is more inclined to be a market-enabler for space with programs like COTS (https://www.nasa.gov/commercial-orbital-transportation-servi...), CCDEV (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Commercial_Crew_Development), and more. Rome wasn't built in a day.

Re: Ask HN: How would you bootstrap a space company?

#149
post #106

Satellites on a chip.

It will be hard to get approval for that to launch (at least from the US). In order to be tracked to ensure the safety of future launches objects need to be much larger than a single chip. Smaller than that the tracking techniques used have trouble tracking the vehicles.

Huh, that's interesting, can you elaborate?

What are the minimum size requirements? Are they multidimensional?

Re: Ask HN: How would you bootstrap a space company?

#150
post #106

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It will be hard to get approval for that to launch (at least from the US). In order to be tracked to ensure the safety of future launches objects need to be much larger than a single chip. Smaller than that the tracking techniques used have trouble tracking the vehicles.

Huh, that's interesting, can you elaborate? What are the minimum size requirements? Are they multidimensional?

I think they want things to be at least 10cm in all dimensions I don't have original sources though it was a while ago. Found this article.

https://www.geospatialworld.net/blogs/controversy-over-us-na...

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