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Ask HN: How do you protect your children from internet addiction?

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Re: Ask HN: How do you protect your children from internet addiction?

#131
I'm going to weigh in on the flipside, and perhaps caution about what not to do.

After getting dumped as a teen, I slipped into a dangerous, self-loathing depression. When I could not find the motivation to call up my friends or organize anything, I could at least message them on AOL Instant Messenger. When my offline peers didn't share my interests, I could find peers that did online - in IRC and in forums. I could lurk even if I couldn't be bothered to talk. Games, music, programming, and technology allowed me to distract myself from the worst of my thoughts and rumination, even when my studies couldn't. I could vent behind a psuedonum instead of worrying those closest to me. My self-found mentors in technology spanned the globe, scattered across the timezones, giving me guidance and new perspectives, despite being hidden behind online psuedonyms without means of other contact.

It perhaps wasn't the healthiest coping mechanism for depression, nor the healthiest relationship with technology, but there are far worse alternatives. And when intelligent, well meaning family labeled me a computer/internet addict when my grades suffered - and largely took away said coping mechanism with incredibly strict limits on my use of technology when I'd previously been given near unlimited free reign - they did not improve the situation or provide better substitutes. They instead made things much worse. The last thing a moody depressed teen needs is severe social isolation, the destruction of their hobbies, and a whole bunch of previously occupied time suddenly be free and in need of filling, when the filler of default is to ruminate.

When I failed to convince them to ease up, I did pick up some new hobbies to distract myself - such as arguing and rebellion, and plotting to break free from their control and gain my independence when I finally came of age. Years(?) later, they eventually backtracked, realizing their meddling wasn't improving things, and would only lead to me being eventually estranged.

I guess my main takeaway here is to warn against assuming addiction is the fundamental problem. It can be a symptom. It can be an imperfect coping mechanism - an attempt at self medication. Limits can be reasonable, but going cold turkey can be incredibly disruptive. It might not kill like going cold turkey with alcohol or some drugs can - but that doesn't mean it can't cause damage.

---

I still don't have a perfectly healthy relationship with technology, but it's okay to have some vices, and I've found some healthier activities. While you'll not find me in a gym, coworkers helped me pick up the habit of walking to lunch. Movie and board game nights give me an excuse to socialize more meaningfully offline while having fun - in part, ironically, by getting back in regular contact with people online with similar interests. I cook more. I now get paid to program, and lean towards leaving work at work. I eat with family from time to time.

I game significantly less now, simply because I gamed enough to get largely bored of it. At least I learned some about teamwork, coordination, and delegation in the process.

I'm not particularly motivated, but I'm at least independent. Pathologically independent to the point of automatically rejecting most familial help, but independent nonetheless.

I've been procrastinating on initiating and hosting more events to further improve my social life, but I'll get there eventually.

Re: Ask HN: How do you protect your children from internet addiction?

#132
post #9

After having spent a fair amount of time using various different tools to attempt to control their screen time, my conclusion is that it was a mistake to have any screens in the house in the first place. A library of great books, good games, craft and art materials, and a collection of musical instruments would have been the best thing for my kids I'm thinking. Screens just make them addicted and miserable.

What is so frustrating is that the schools have pushed this on us. We were mostly screen-free in our house, until our oldest started middle school. Now she has homework she has to do on her Chromebook every night. Only of course she pulls it out and is playing games every time she has a chance. I can't take it away because she has to get her homework done, but I can't control what she accesses either and it is destroying her interest in anything else.

Re: Ask HN: How do you protect your children from internet addiction?

#133

My kid's almost three. From day one, we've implemented a zero screen policy. That means no phones, tablets, computers, TV (don't own one), etc. We've read to her since day one and she loves books now and her spoken/listening language skills are way ahead for her age. Wife speaks to her in her native language so she's growing up bilingual too. Wife takes her to parks, mommy and me classes where they have story time, s…

This made me smile. We did this with our elder daughter (now 12). It worked and then the pandemic came where they were given their chromebooks to take home. Luckily only YouTube was allowed. But still it did cause quite a bump in screen usage. Obviously the younger daughter caught on (now 8) and decided hey I can do YouTube as well.

Since last year as things have normalized, we basically restarted a bunch of their sports activities. Both kids had reading requirements from school and both seem to be in a spot where they will read before bed by themselves. The elder one reads quite a bit, probably around 1-1.5 hrs at night. The younger kid about 20-25 mins. They still do about 5-8 hrs of screen time each week. Still too much in my opinion but they also do a lot of stuff not on screen.

I still haven’t given them phones or devices. I myself have an iPhone-6 so not much runs on it either. But as the big kid starts being more independent I think a phone is going to be necessary.

My advice, if any, is keep non screen activities and person to person activity a priority. But keep in mind that her friends may get video games a lot earlier and they do form peers online which translate into peers in person.

Re: Ask HN: How do you protect your children from internet addiction?

#134
One solution is to spend time with them doing activities, playing.

I have noticed children (below 3) DO NOT prefer tablets/phones. If you give a two-year a tablet, wait until they are completed engaged and ask them "wanna go outside?" they will forget the tablet. Kids always prefer to play, but when parents do/can not spend time with them, they will happily find entertainment elsewhere.

I haven't tested this with children above 3, but I suspect it is the same up to 12.

Re: Ask HN: How do you protect your children from internet addiction?

#136

My kid's almost three. From day one, we've implemented a zero screen policy. That means no phones, tablets, computers, TV (don't own one), etc. We've read to her since day one and she loves books now and her spoken/listening language skills are way ahead for her age. Wife speaks to her in her native language so she's growing up bilingual too. Wife takes her to parks, mommy and me classes where they have story time, s…

I don't find this inspirational compared to another comment "it's better to know about that stuff and how to deal with it than to create a temporary secure enclave at home where it doesn't exist." since the temporary enclave won't be effective but I am curious if there is inspiration on how you keep your kids entertained at restaurants. So many parents just find an ipad to be a sedative that its basically a baby sitt…

> since the temporary enclave won't be effective

So far it's been very effective. My kid has no interest in screens and likes to do real world stuff instead.

I realize I won't be able to shield her from them forever nor would that be a good idea. But these are literally formative years. From age 0 to 3, the human brain grows to 80% of its adult size, 90% by 5. What happens during these years have an outsized impact on their rest of their lives. Let's set them up for success as much as possible. That's why it's been zero screen from day one and as long as possible. When will I introduce screens? Don't know. Will cross that bridge when we get there. Right now, we're doing great with no screens.

> How do you handle that? Bored kid at a restaurant, possibly misbehaving.

Answered here https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=34021771

Re: Ask HN: How do you protect your children from internet addiction?

#137

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Same here with our son. 2,5 years old and we bring him to restaurants or friends with ease. We don’t entertain him with a phone or screen. He also sits with us, eats with us. Sometimes we do bring a toy car, or pencils for him to draw. But that’s it. Great side effect is that he eats everything. From olives to onions. He sees us eating and he mimics. That’s the whole parenting game imho. I don’t believe you are lucky…

I had 5. Two could do restaurants. Two not so well. For the other, we brought toy cars and ordered piles of mashed potatoes for him to drive thru.

> we brought toy cars and ordered piles of mashed potatoes for him to drive thru.

Brilliant! Way better than screens in my opinion.

Re: Ask HN: How do you protect your children from internet addiction?

#138
post #102
post #98

Parent of three ranging from tween to college age. We have never had limits on anything. Screen time/content unrestricted. Probably dozens of times, maybe hundreds, we have had "the talk" about how there's a lot of weird shit in the world, internet included, and it's better to know about that stuff and how to deal with it than to create a temporary secure enclave at home where it doesn't exist. We especially didn't w…

Amazing attitude. The mother of my kid and I are separated. I wanted to restrict content/screen time, but she gave him unrestricted access to his iPhone and now I feel it can't be undone. He's 13. I'm mostly worried about his attention span, especially when I watch him use his phone. But then again, maybe this is just a different generation and I must understand that his way of using the internet is different from mi…

I think (barring excesses) they’ll generally be fine regardless of the way the parent raises them. It’s mostly about me feeling good about the way I’m raising my kids.

Re: Ask HN: How do you protect your children from internet addiction?

#139
post #98

Parent of three ranging from tween to college age. We have never had limits on anything. Screen time/content unrestricted. Probably dozens of times, maybe hundreds, we have had "the talk" about how there's a lot of weird shit in the world, internet included, and it's better to know about that stuff and how to deal with it than to create a temporary secure enclave at home where it doesn't exist. We especially didn't w…

This! Parenting is not a "Here is the rule, here is the consequence" job. Raising responsible humans requires, well, giving them responsibility, the opportunity for soft failures to learn from and having those awkward long talks and figuring out how to set healthy boundaries.

The other part of the equation: The internet is an important aspect of the current generation's identity and culture. What seems like addiction to us could very well be our children's identity, lifestyle. The comparison to TVs is flawed because TV is not social. The unhealthy aspects have to be spoken about in the same vein as drinking and drugs, but any kind of limit-setting that doesn't acknowledge this might push children away from conversation.

There is an hilarious episode of Everybody Loves Raymond that goes into this with refreshing honesty.

Re: Ask HN: How do you protect your children from internet addiction?

#140
I think your answer depends on their age. Honestly anyone where their oldest kids are younger than 5 and proclaiming how awesome they are as their kids don't use screens obviously did not do digital learning during the pandemic, where kids had to be in front of screens, or work from home with kids who had limited means to entertain themselves for a full day.

My eldest just started elementary school. She doesn't own her own devices so any videos or fun stuff on the tablet is earned through a reward system and usually we're around to ensure she doesn't go off the rails. I did uninstall YouTube on the ipad. Now she has only PBS kids, purchased videos from iTunes and the likes.

No netflix at home...any movies, tv shows is rented from the library - which also they can watch w/ reward system. Living room is full of toys, activities books etc for things they can pick up and easily do. It's not in a dedicated "toy room" where they play out of sight. Though, the living room does end up being messy all the time.

My daughter already asks for things she sees from other kids, like piercings and toys...I'm able to say no now but it'll be a hard battle in the future when kids at her school or on her bus watch TikTok or browse social media.

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