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Ask HN: What caused the Olympics to become so terrible?

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Re: Ask HN: What caused the Olympics to become so terrible?

#131

Post by greatgib »

dotBen wrote: post #95
lokar wrote: post #35

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It seems like there was this crazy escalation of spending promises to win the bid. At some point responsible democracies dropped out, the irresponsible democracies, so all that was left were authoritarian nations looking to improve their image without changing. Now it seems like even the authoritarian nations are deciding it's to expensive and you see responsible democracies getting back in with more realistic bids.

Except that the next Olympics are due to be held in France, Italy, USA, Australia - and only one of those is partly an authoritarian nation. [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Olympic_Games_host_cit...

If you follow a little bit France on news or Twitter, you will see that Paris is kind of an authoritarian city with a mayor that created in a few years a debt that no one had seen before.

Now, most normal people in France would have like the thing to be cancelled instead of having their taxes being wasted with that

Re: Ask HN: What caused the Olympics to become so terrible?

#132

Post by [deleted] »

greatgib wrote: post #131
dotBen wrote: post #95

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Except that the next Olympics are due to be held in France, Italy, USA, Australia - and only one of those is partly an authoritarian nation. [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Olympic_Games_host_cit...

If you follow a little bit France on news or Twitter, you will see that Paris is kind of an authoritarian city with a mayor that created in a few years a debt that no one had seen before. Now, most normal people in France would have like the thing to be cancelled instead of having their taxes being wasted with that

[deleted]

Re: Ask HN: What caused the Olympics to become so terrible?

#133

Post by hakfoo »

Graffur wrote: post #126
hakfoo wrote: post #117

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I hear you entirely. I tend to think there are countries which have reached the "no-win" stage of public relations. It sort of reminds me of when the UN sent inspectors to Iraq looking for the legendary WMDs-- even transparency wasn't good enough. The fix is in, and there's no reasonable sequence of definite actions they can perform that would get China on the West's good side. They could walk Joe Biden personally th…

What positive story are you talking about? That the Olympics isn't that popular or is "terrible" as the OP describes it? Who is talking about the people who delivered the event, and who is slandering them in this conversation? You say "5000km away" but it is the same government. Have a read through this https://www.bbc.com/news/world-asia-china-22278037

I'm saying that building the facilities and hosting the ceremonies are a lot of hard work for tens of thousands of people. That they were able to pull the event off as smoothly as they have, during a global pandemic, is still an accomplishment, regardless of the TV ratings.

Maybe we can say that once in a while without having to frame it in the context of "TeH cCp EvIl AnD fAiLiNg"

Saying "it's the same government" is rather a broad-brush. When there's a new library or stadium built in Phoenix, do we belittle the hard work of the contractors and architects over what ICE is going with immigrant children?

You see that sort of coverage on a lot of news about China. "20,000 km of high speed rail built in a year" or "space program is proceeding smoothly" inevitably pivots to human-rights potshots, even when the actions in the story have only the most gossamer links to it.

Re: Ask HN: What caused the Olympics to become so terrible?

#134

Post by blindmute »

homo_ergaster wrote: post #124
blindmute wrote: post #121

I watch the summer Olympics every time they happen. While there are some minor annoyances that the IOC introduces some years, the games are largely just as good as they ever were (except 2021). Culturally in America, I expect people care less because they have been indoctrinated against any form of nationalism. There is also a recent trend in the West of disparaging achievement in general. Where people used to admire…

> indoctrinated against any form of nationalism In America? Every morning in school they make all the kids stand up and recite a pledge of allegiance to the nation

Yeah, 20 seconds per day in school vs a constant bombardment of the opposite from every media and cultural institution the average young adult would ever be exposed to. It is very much out of vogue to be nationalistic.

Re: Ask HN: What caused the Olympics to become so terrible?

#135

Post by anm89 »

colordrops wrote: post #108
Graffur wrote: post #106

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> The Olympics is about setting that aside for a moment https://www.bbc.com/news/world-asia-china-55794071 Ah.. just set it aside for just a moment..

You are repeating state department propaganda about Uighur camps. Most of the information about Xinjiang has been coming from CIA contractors and vague satellite photos. They were claiming that 2 million (out of 10 million) people were in camps until it became untenable to maintain this lie. There's no doubt that China is an authoritarian state with major human rights issues there, but it's not at the scale being cla…

So your argument here is that their concentration camps aren't that bad because it's actually only a million people that are in them, instead of two million people?

Yeah China has a record of harvesting organs and running concentration camps for the purposes of ethnic cleansing. People probably aren't going to stop repeating that fact any time soon.

Re: Ask HN: What caused the Olympics to become so terrible?

#136

Post by james-redwood »

mrkentutbabi wrote: post #80
airstrike wrote: post #17

It made more sense before globalization. It was a chance to consider going to some unexpected destination, bringing people together from all nations. Maybe take your spouse or your kids with you, go on a cruise, hire a tour guide, grab a book with some tips and short phrases in the local language and embark on an exciting adventure. In the 21st century, we interact with the rest of the world on a daily basis. You can…

This is what I’ve become. I don’t think I am racist, and I came to the US liking the diversity, that was about ten years ago. Now I think I’ve had enough of it, and would rather have familiarity and harmony. I began to resent diversity actually.

It’s an international tournament? Diversity is inevitable in that situation. I get what you mean though. I grew up in then Rhodesia, followed by stints in South Africa as effectively a refugee followed by the UK, and honestly I miss having a community of people who all share the exact same experiences as you in the same place. It’s the small town feeling I guess.

I don’t resent the UK and US for becoming like this though: I feel you can have the best of both worlds. London for instance is a very international city, but even if you venture even half an hour out of the M25 you’ll find very homogenous neighbourhoods (in fact, this is even true within London now that I think about it).

Re: Ask HN: What caused the Olympics to become so terrible?

#137

Post by colordrops »

anm89 wrote: post #135
colordrops wrote: post #108

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You are repeating state department propaganda about Uighur camps. Most of the information about Xinjiang has been coming from CIA contractors and vague satellite photos. They were claiming that 2 million (out of 10 million) people were in camps until it became untenable to maintain this lie. There's no doubt that China is an authoritarian state with major human rights issues there, but it's not at the scale being cla…

So your argument here is that their concentration camps aren't that bad because it's actually only a million people that are in them, instead of two million people? Yeah China has a record of harvesting organs and running concentration camps for the purposes of ethnic cleansing. People probably aren't going to stop repeating that fact any time soon.

No, that's not my argument. That's a strawman - don't put words in my mouth.

The only evidence for everything you are saying is from CIA contractors and documents of questionable provenance. The US has obvious conflict of interest when reporting on the misdeeds of their biggest competitor. It's an obvious smear campaign.

There is evidence of abuse and mistreatment of Uighurs yes, but not a full scale genocide and jailing of millions. It's a lie, or at most, a gross exaggeration.

But that wasn't my point. My point is why is China specifically picked on? Why didn't the US detail their own human rights abuses when they hosted the Olympics? They are easily argued to be as bad or worse. As mentioned, the US has far more minorities in actual prison, and prisoners in the US are LEGALLY subject to unpaid labor, basically slaves. This is 100% true and easily verifiable, not hidden or a conspiracy.

This doesn't even get into the millions killed overseas by the US military. But I guess that's not human rights abuse, because those brown middle easterners arent human in your eyes. Or, they aren't human unless abused by china.

Re: Ask HN: What caused the Olympics to become so terrible?

#139

Post by ruh-roh »

Not sure what you mean by "regardless of timezone".

I was lucky to be in a foreign country during an Olympics (Australia). They had no delusions of grandeur (except maybe in swimming). They interviewed winners regardless of country, they told stories regardless of country. They showed events live.

Dick Ebersol stubbornly kept the standard practice of tape-delaying major events to prime time in the US, long past viability in the Twitter/ESPN/Google ecosystem. In some cases (swimming), they have lobbied to change the schedule so live events can be live in the US prime time window. I believe Michael Phelps's 2008 Beijing races were at 7am local time. Surely other countries loved that.

Re: Ask HN: What caused the Olympics to become so terrible?

#140

Post by bjelkeman-again »

sp332 wrote: post #110
bjelkeman-again wrote: post #18

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The coverage is very different where I am. Discovery plus has love and archive footage of nearly everything to stream.

From what I can see, Discovery+ only has Olympics content available in the UK, Italy, and Spain. https://sports.yahoo.com/analysis-discovery-beijing-winter-o...

And Sweden
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