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Ask HN: I'm away from the software industry since 2017; what has happened since?

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Re: Ask HN: I'm away from the software industry since 2017; what has happened since?

#131

Post by FillardMillmore »

madeofpalk wrote: post #120
_xnmw wrote: post #104

If you're still suspicious of SPAs, you can be sure there's still an alternate universe outside of the Valley bubble that builds server-side web apps on modern frameworks, though now we use Vue.js instead of jQuery. PHP has continued to be a top language of choice for the working class dev, and Laravel is an example of one of the most beautifully crafted (and wildly popular) web frameworks ever made. Examples of the…

> language of choice for the working class dev What an incredibly strange framing.

So are you implying that you're not filled with the spirit of the proletariat when you program in PHP?

Re: Ask HN: I'm away from the software industry since 2017; what has happened since?

#132

Post by ithrow »

kanzenryu2 wrote: post #102
Scarbutt wrote: post #17

Java's market share is declining fast. Ruby and Clojure are dead, literally for Clojure, most libs are from >7 years ago. Javascript(and TS) and Python are the tools of the trade to achieve most common things. Devs are starting to realize how they got fooled by Rust's marketing/hype train for general purpose programming/exploration/prototyping and productivity because it's too restrictive and its compile times are at…

Clojure is more of a case of stability rather than death. Most libs have not needed updating in 7 years. Compare that to other languages which frequently "trigger the libs" ;-)

Yeah, Clojure libraries are feature complete, bug free and never need maintenance ever. /s

Re: Ask HN: I'm away from the software industry since 2017; what has happened since?

#133

Post by FillardMillmore »

benibela wrote: post #85
daxfohl wrote: post #30

Perf is becoming more important than it had been. Rust is still around and growing. WASM is becoming mainstream. You see some people migrating away from things that require garbage collection. Edge is becoming real, with Cloudflare and Fastly doing edge functions/workers, and AWS having come out with outposts, local zones, and wavelength (deploy AWS VMs to Verizon 5G hubs). AWS is still eating the world, Azure is doi…

>Perf is becoming more important than it had been My eyesight is becoming worse, but I read that as Perl

I like Perl, but it's had a bit of an identity crisis since Perl 6. I believe late last year, they renamed it to Raku as a 'solution' to this identity crisis. I still think Perl can get the job done in a lot of different circumstances and, despite the fact that it's not really used as widely for web tooling as it was in the late '90s, it's still an invaluable scripting tool for sysadmins still willing to dip their toes in and learn it. As others have noted, the 'shiny new toy' effect has made Perl less attractive, but I think Perl has unfairly gotten a bad rap, especially in regards to opinions of how 'ugly' the language is - I tend to think it's more elegant than ugly. And of course, any programming language can be ugly - all depends on how clever the programmer in question wants to be.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Raku_(programming_language)

Re: Ask HN: I'm away from the software industry since 2017; what has happened since?

#134

Post by calibas »

jnbiche wrote: post #130
_xnmw wrote: post #104

If you're still suspicious of SPAs, you can be sure there's still an alternate universe outside of the Valley bubble that builds server-side web apps on modern frameworks, though now we use Vue.js instead of jQuery. PHP has continued to be a top language of choice for the working class dev, and Laravel is an example of one of the most beautifully crafted (and wildly popular) web frameworks ever made. Examples of the…

> though now we use Vue.js instead of jQuery You realize Vue.js is fundamentally an SPA framework, right? It's got built-in router, state management, etc. In frontend dev, those are all things that are only SPAs really need. To people "suspicious" of SPAs: are you suspicious of Gmail? Slack? Those are typical use-cases of SPAs. What you're actually suspicious about are ill-informed devs building SPAs when they should…

Vue has an official router, but it's not built in and usually something like Vuex is used for state management. I'd certainly agree Vue is oriented towards SPAs, but that's not all it does.

Re: Ask HN: I'm away from the software industry since 2017; what has happened since?

#135

Post by rewq4321 »

JDiculous wrote: post #128
daxfohl wrote: post #91

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Node, maybe. There's still plenty of it out there but more skepticism about perf and npm, and less hype that it will be the great general unifier of front and back ends. They were probably equal in 2017, but now go seems to have far surpassed it in terms of server side relevance.

I'd have to see some stats to believe that because that's certainly not the trend I'm seeing. Nodejs is pretty strong, and generally the bottleneck is dev speed and network latency, not CPU performance.

Agreed, I'd like to see stats on this. From the stars on the Deno repo it looks like the server-side JS market is only going to get bigger.

Re: Ask HN: I'm away from the software industry since 2017; what has happened since?

#136

Post by OJFord »

dpacmittal wrote: post #103
hanklazard wrote: post #89

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Ha! I realized this yesterday after considering it (very briefly) for a home lab deployment—I’m pretty sure I dodged a cannonball on that one.

Docker-compose with nginx-proxy should work well for home labs.

Until it's not just one machine. You might briefly then use Swarm... But does anyone for long, whether production or home?

K8s has its complexities for sure, but to me it's the simplest - or at least 'only figure it out once' way of running multiple machines (besides having 'the webserver', 'the db server' etc., of course.)

Re: Ask HN: I'm away from the software industry since 2017; what has happened since?

#137

Post by Dowwie »

Rust has grown tremendously in the last few years. People are using it as a general purpose language, from Unix command line utilities to industrial IoT services. Greenfield projects are using Rust as are next generation refactoring projects. Game development, multimedia, and even data scientists are showing increased usage. Embedded adoption is growing but at a slower rate. I'm not going to drop names until announcements are made but companies that have used Go for flagship products are no longer doing so. They're rewriting in Rust. Healthcare startup(s) who are building systems to compete with Epic are using Rust. Government contractors working on intelligence systems are also using it.

Re: Ask HN: I'm away from the software industry since 2017; what has happened since?

#139

Post by spion »

analognoise wrote: post #108
mixedCase wrote: post #5

Probably the most surprising thing for you: Go is getting generics. No exact timeline, but it's happening for Go 2.0. Rust is seeing production use in many places and its being accepted more as the sane alternative to C for modern development of high performance software. Ecosystem still not big or mature enough to make big waves, however, but that depends on how you interpret "big waves". SPAs are used and abused, t…

"Rust is making waves!" Rust ranks lower than Delphi on TIOBE, isn't used in a single aerospace, defense, or critical application. Ada has been for almost 40 years, is backward compatible to Ada '83, and has a proof subset (SPARK). Those waves look more like pond ripples caused by a light breeze. How about, "Rust - now with bigger pond ripples."

If you take the time to read about it, you'll quickly realize TIOBE is pretty bad.

Re: Ask HN: I'm away from the software industry since 2017; what has happened since?

#140

Post by justsee »

mc3 wrote: post #96
satvikpendem wrote: post #72

Earlier quoted context omitted.

https://nextjs.org/ It's a server side rendered framework for React. It can also do static sites but doesn't have as many plugins as Gatsby JS, which focuses on static site building with React.

Yeah the idea of building a 100% static site in react seems a bit ironic to me. Handlebars is so much simpler to work with for a static site (like a blog) that isn't going to "spring to life" and become a SPA. But I can see it being useful in the niche area of someone who needs to do server side rendering for performance (every millisecond to first render counts), while keeping the code simple by not having a second…

Next.js positions itself as a hybrid framework, and is recommending SSG (static site generation) by default over SSR.

See this discussion [1] with the response from rauchg (framework author and Zeit founder) outlining where they are heading.

This ability to easily mix SSG and SSR pages within the one project, the PHP-inspired philosophy of simple file-based routing for pages, and pre-configured babel / webpack with easy customisation are a few things that draw people into next.js dev.

Like anything that deals with reasonable complexity there are a bunch of concepts to understand, but once that happens next.js feels like a thin layer around "it's just react".

I particularly like being able to drop api functions with a standard req / res signature into `pages/api` to immediately have some server-side api endpoints available, which can be deployed to Zeit's now as Lambdas with minimal fuss. It significantly reduces the friction of thinking about and implementing front-end sites with custom api endpoints for whatever you're building.

[1]: https://github.com/zeit/next.js/discussions/10437

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