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Ask HN: Is the Great Resignation in tech real? If so, why?

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121–130 of 270 posts

Re: Ask HN: Is the Great Resignation in tech real? If so, why?

#121
post #111

Remote and increased liquidity are the two biggest drivers. Remote is making people reevaluate work/life balance in general, some people that aren't getting their preferences matched in this regard are thus leaving. Huge amounts of liquidity means there is now a lot more money sloshing around in the pockets of startups and public tech companies that raised money in the 2020/2021 equities boom. Tech companies suck at…

Appropriate retention based raises actually require a huge quantity of finesse and genuine ability from line managers and HR.

Even if a company is willing to do so in in good faith, a rarity, a "market price" raise consumes an extraordinary amount of paperwork and HR time and effort.

You take your employee, often parked with a nebulous job title and a role that has morphed entirely from the one they were hired for.

Then you have to define their current role and skill-set exactly, then research the correct band to index that role to in the job market.

For my extremely diverse cross functional team, understanding the market price for the SQL engineer vs the Python engineer in my niche is absurdly complex.

Half the reason they don't do it is because it's just genuinely so much effort to go to. And most of the time the engineer doesn't even appreciate it because they're jumping ship for a change of scenery more than anything.

Re: Ask HN: Is the Great Resignation in tech real? If so, why?

#123

A lot of anecdotes in this thread, but it’s important to keep it in perspective: The current employee turnover rates are higher than they have been, but when you look at the numbers it’s about 2.8% monthly quit rate compared to an average of around 2%: https://fred.stlouisfed.org/series/JTSQUR So yes, it’s up, but the news articles trying to explain this as some sort of society-wide shift and pushing anecdotes of peo…

> A lot of anecdotes in this thread, but it’s important to keep it in perspective

Yet these numbers need to be kept in perspective: they're quit rates for all non-farm jobs. The quit rate for any individual job sector can be much higher than the average rate. So while the average quit rate isn't way higher than the past few years, it certainly seems like the tech sector is seeing a lot of shuffling around.

Re: Ask HN: Is the Great Resignation in tech real? If so, why?

#125
FWIW your theory 3 (the first one, "people avoided changing jobs during the pandemic") was verbally confirmed by Google HR in a recent internal conversation known as TGIF. It was also mentioned that if attrition rates for 2020 and 2021 were averaged, it wasn't abnormally high.

Re: Ask HN: Is the Great Resignation in tech real? If so, why?

#127
post #82

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I was on a team of 2 and my coworker left for Google for a little under $300k I had a coworker leave to be an L4 SWE at Google earning the same in 2017. I don't know if the anecdote is relevant to the 2021 Great Resignation if people were doing the same thing 4 years ago (unless your colleague got an L3 offer for that amount).

check levels.fyi

In fact levels.fyi shows an L4 Google SWE earning about $270k. GP's story of someone earning $300k in 2017 is certainly an outlier.

Re: Ask HN: Is the Great Resignation in tech real? If so, why?

#128
I'm an executive at a european SaaS Company that got recently bought out by a larger one from the anglo-sphere. The management of the parent company is fighting tooth and nail to retain people and hire additional ones as they have strong growth targets, and are adding more HR Staff because of this.

Due to the acquisition I'm in the position to talk to random people all over the organization from a semi-outside perspective and it has given me some insight I was lacking of this company, I assume many anglo-american companies share:

1. This company cannot divert the course of their goal to lower engineering cost, it's engrained in their financial models that push them towards IPO. -> Lowering engineering cost meant opening up offices in europe, eastern europe and asia and paying slightly above the local rate. -> This strategy is starting to fall apart as the labor quality from these places AT THE PRICEPOINT is dropping, as the experienced engineers have started working for full U.S. or full central european salaries and aren't going back. It will take a lot of time until the "our HR just isn't effective at hiring & retaining"-narrative changes into the "our strategy doesn't apply to the global labor market anymore"-narrative because the waters are extremely muddy.

2. If you pay for actual data, you can basically only get simple spreadsheets of salary/profession & level, the sources of which seem very unreliable and the conclusions you draw from them unhelpful. The employees themselves also don't make good decisions as on their behalf and so false signalling is going on a lot.

3. It takes management clout to push through U.S. Salaries for people in lower-income environments and is depending on the company culture frowned upon so kept a secret if it occurs. This has the potential to create cabals and "more equal than others" pockets in the org-chart.

4. The very people tasked with retaining their teams are also affected by the shifting landscape themselves and depending on their stance become very emotional around this topic as the pressure on them increases. Some develop a stockholm-syndrome-esque attitude when they personally don't want to leave or feel they don't deserve more, that creates tension because they quickly arrive at unhealthy points of the discussion and say things like "if you are only in it for the money, this is not the place" which is something you don't ever want your manager to phrase like that, although because of 1-3, this is going to be true for quite some time.

5. The employee-part of the discussion about payscale and cost-of-living adjustments is just getting started as inflation is increasing, open Q&A meetings have started to revolve around this topic. As much as the communication is centered on positivity for this company, this seems to cloud every other topic as a segment of the employees have stopped thinking further ahead than 6 months as they seem to wait how this will play out.

All in all, I'm very unsure if I will be able to stay at this company because of this situation, ironically this would hurt me financially, but the environment does not feel like a healthy one where I'd not only enjoy my time but will do anything but crisis management.

Re: Ask HN: Is the Great Resignation in tech real? If so, why?

#129

Equities have done great during covid. If you were invested in tech which many in FANGM were via ESPPs and RSUs, wealth likely significantly increased. If your net worth hits a couple M, you make 200k/year just on interest. For a salary to make any difference to a person living a middle class life, they are going to need to pay you in the upper 6 to low 7 figures. That prices you out of the market so may as well stay…

How exactly are you earning 10% interest?

Re: Ask HN: Is the Great Resignation in tech real? If so, why?

#130
post #29

Pre-Covid much of my job satisfaction came from the sense of comradery of working on a team. Even as an introvert I enjoy interacting with coworkers, and being intune with the needs of the group and generally helping other people succeed. When we transitioned to full remote, all of this was stripped away and I was left to focus purely on a product that on its own I was not passionate about (think ad-like product). I…

Another introvert here, working fully remotely since before COVID. I couldn't imagine working on a product I wasn't passionate about and genuinely wanted to succeed. Most of my motivation is based around doing interesting and socially valuable work. This doesn't have to be groundbreaking, but knowing I'm helping put out some good in the world is a large factor in choosing and staying with a company.

The team is also important, of course, but it's minor compared to the product as the way of working remotely is quite different from being in an office. To me it's mostly for the better, since everyone is focused on the product and not on some pointless team building events, company gossip or drama.

I hope you chose a more fulfilling industry than advertising. It's interesting that a sibling comment also mentions working on ads. I wonder what the breakdown of resignations per industry looks like, and how relevant remote work was in that decision.

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