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Ask HN: GPT4 Broke Me

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Re: Ask HN: GPT4 Broke Me

#111

Post by chang1 »

Xenoamorphous wrote: post #54
codingdave wrote: post #13

The more I use GPT, the less I'm worried. It is a tool, and a good one, but not a replacement for the thought required to design an app that will function, scale, and have good UX to result in a marketable product. So use it and enjoy its benefits while letting it help you perform even better. As far as everything else you've said... oof, you need a break. You seem focused on money and ego. Maybe it is time to simpli…

> The more I use GPT, the less I'm worried I'm curious, as I see quite a few people saying this. You might not be worried about GPT4, but aren't you at least a little concerned about GPT8 or whatever? Just having a post like this a mere 5 years ago would've been unthinkable yet here we are.

I had a similar moment of existential career crisis as OP.

I'm at the 20 year mark as well, in terms of developing software professionally. I've always felt like with new technology, I could grok at a high level how things worked. But LLMs like GPT seem like magic and I went through stages of initial astonishment -> despair realizing the potential impact it would have on the industry -> acceptance.

While I still feel uncertainty and fear about the future, as others have echoed, I'm realizing it's a tool for developers to use. We can either choose to accept it and understand how to work with it, or reject it. The things GPT can generate amazes me, but I'm finding that it's a good starting point or reference to build on... not a final solution. It will generate things that are sometimes completely wrong, and it's your own experience and judgement that has to be used to determine that. GPT cannot do that... at least not yet.

I think back 20 years ago and remember reading through a lot of physical books with occasional web searches landing on experts-exchange or random forums. Then came Stack Overflow and that became in invaluable tool, along with the ubiquity of free tutorials on YouTube and elsewhere. And now we have GPT which I'll ask if I really get stuck on something and it gives me new ideas to try. Perhaps in the near future, GPT is the tool that I'll use first.

I found this podcast episode helpful for me to process what I’ve felt: [Lex Fridman Podcast #376 – Stephen Wolfram: ChatGPT and the Nature of Truth, Reality & Computation][1].

It's an unsettling feeling (in general) to feel like a foundation you've built and live on could potentially be made quickly irrelevant. I'd like to say I have words of wisdom to get rid of that feeling but I don't. What has helped me is to acknowledge these feelings as valid, and then try to get clarity in what direction to move. It's not the foundation itself that's important per se, but it's the skills you've acquired in building the foundation that's more important.

[1]: https://lexfridman.com/stephen-wolfram-4/

Re: Ask HN: GPT4 Broke Me

#112

Post by thaway_thaway34 »

gizmo wrote: post #82
wokwokwok wrote: post #68

I’m amazed at the number of people responding to this and answering the question they want to answer, not the question the OP is asking. > It just feels like anyone could do it. This. Yes, you’re 100% right. No, AI will not take away all the jobs, that’s not going to happen, but no one thinks it’s going to happen , anyone calling that out and saying… “don’t worry! AI is just a tool…” are beating a strawman. The reali…

Today, chatGPT can do zero percent 0% of the actual programming I do. I use chatGPT to find a library function or to find command line options and other simple stuff. But actual programming? ChatGPT can only write completely trivial scaffolding code. I don’t understand how people get a significant productivity boost out of it when chatGPT can’t do design, can’t do algorithms, can’t do concurrency, can’t do architectu…

You’re probably not talking to it right way. You need to build up the story. It doesn’t look up information, it only maintains coherence. You need to bring up key points for your design, have a chat. Then start asking for code. Unless you have a starting code, then give that and chat on top of it.

I am getting at least 5x boost in productivity.

Just last night, I solved 7-8 bugs consecutively.

Re: Ask HN: GPT4 Broke Me

#113

Post by thaway_thaway34 »

animuchan wrote: post #91
wokwokwok wrote: post #68

I’m amazed at the number of people responding to this and answering the question they want to answer, not the question the OP is asking. > It just feels like anyone could do it. This. Yes, you’re 100% right. No, AI will not take away all the jobs, that’s not going to happen, but no one thinks it’s going to happen , anyone calling that out and saying… “don’t worry! AI is just a tool…” are beating a strawman. The reali…

Yep, that's exactly the thing. If a random person + GPT makes a programmer equal to me in skill, then me + GPT makes a programmer who's at least 150% of my skill (for some definition of skill), so it's all good.

I know I will be taking the devils advocate to another level but…;

Is there such a thing as %150 developer, Is there a market for the %150 developer?

All of these are not yet answered or tested by the market.

Re: Ask HN: GPT4 Broke Me

#114

Post by codingdave »

thefz wrote: post #102
codingdave wrote: post #13

The more I use GPT, the less I'm worried. It is a tool, and a good one, but not a replacement for the thought required to design an app that will function, scale, and have good UX to result in a marketable product. So use it and enjoy its benefits while letting it help you perform even better. As far as everything else you've said... oof, you need a break. You seem focused on money and ego. Maybe it is time to simpli…

> It is a tool, and a good one Not even a good one imo, I ask it to cite its sources and it makes up the URLs 95% of the time.

That makes sense - it is an LLM, not a reference library.

Part of using a tool well is understanding what it is good for and what it is not. If you are .looking for citable references... or even full factual accuracy, it is the wrong tool.

Re: Ask HN: GPT4 Broke Me

#115

Post by kaba0 »

ChatGPT can only regurgitate problems (in potentially a new form) whose solutions were explicitly found in its problem domain, for all practical purposes.

If you didn’t fear “kids with stackoverflow” taking away your job, then you really shouldn’t do it anymore with chatgpt. It writing anything remotely complex is just.. we don’t even know how far away that is.

Re: Ask HN: GPT4 Broke Me

#116

Post by thaway_thaway34 »

causi wrote: post #12

I have been already working nearly at a burn-out level for many years to reach this comp. If you have the willpower to do that I wouldn't worry that much. Maybe use the extra productivity ChatGPT gives you to learn some skills that LLM-AIs will take a long, long time to learn if ever: specialization. Industrial programming, scientific programming, etc. One of the reasons I'm not worried about AI is that I work with m…

I have experience in hardware/embedded and done industrial stuff, monitoring 100 to 1000 factories.

But the compensation is much lower in these fields in Europe/UK, compared to web :/

Re: Ask HN: GPT4 Broke Me

#117

Post by thaway_thaway34 »

GianFabien wrote: post #53
wiseowise wrote: post #33

This is obvious troll, why do people even reply seriously to this?

That was my reaction too. How could you be in top 5% and be able to use ChatGPT to "automate" any significant portion of your work? It just doesn't compute!

[flagged]

Re: Ask HN: GPT4 Broke Me

#118

Post by iJohnDoe »

me_me_me wrote: post #84
cj wrote: post #20

My dad ran a local dental lab for 30+ years, making crowns and bridges for local dentists. Over the course of a few years, dentists began using 3D scanners to digitally scan patient impressions, which allowed them to email the scans to my dad's dental lab (previously he'd have to drive to each dentist and pick it up in person). Then, 1-2 years later, they started emailing the 3D scan to a company in China who would d…

> Technology has been displacing jobs for decades. Life is about learning and adapting. As long as you commit to adapting quickly, learning new skills as necessary and being open to different types of jobs, you should be fine. That seems to be a contradiction of your story. Your dad was lucky to be able to retire. He did not adapt. He had to quit and he got low end job. Its easy to say adapt re-skill, innovate but to…

I think there are some good takeaways or lessons from this situation.

My first takeaway is if the dentists didn’t give the Dad an opportunity to compete on price and went straight to China. One day you’re getting orders and the next day you are not. Tough situation. A pivot would need to be done quickly. Once the dad caught wind of the China situation, maybe he could outsource his stuff to China as well and lower his prices. Is there any margin left though?

Same thing with GPT. One day you’re getting contracts for work and the next day you’re not. You later find out they are using GPT.

One day people are picking cotton and the next day a machine is doing it.

The OP‘s concern is real. One good aspect is that everyone is aware GPT is here. The time is now to pivot or adapt. Those that wait to find out what will happen are usually at a disadvantage to those that act more quickly.

Re: Ask HN: GPT4 Broke Me

#119

Post by rsd79 »

For the last 20 years in web development you've adapted to plenty of technology changes. Double the 20 years timeframe and you'll find developers working in assembler on daily basis - just think about how far you are from there. AI is a very significant change (maybe even the most significant one in the 40 years timeframe) and a serious risk if your plan was to stop adapting, but it is essentially a tool to bring programming to a higher level of abstraction. Less work on form validations, but more on building value.

We are still early adopters in using AI to increase productivity. The society as a whole is not yet aware of what is coming and the results are essentially unpredictable. Your attachment to the top 5% salary band might be irrelevant in 10 or 20 years because we might live in some kind of eco-utopia by then. Or all wealth might move to AI-controlling entities, in which your current standing is irrelevant and beyond your control.

Stop worrying. Focus on figuring out ways to increase your output with the help of the new tool or invest in AI to ride the wave you expect to drown in. You're way ahead of the 7.5b other people.

Re: Ask HN: GPT4 Broke Me

#120

Post by BizarreByte »

naveen99 wrote: post #89
BizarreByte wrote: post #15

With any luck a couple of lawsuits over copyright will completely nerf this ML/AI stuff in the bud and you won't have to worry as much.

LOL, I don’t think so. If LLM’s fail, they will have to fail on their own. probably programmers will get more competition from non-programmer humans leveraging LLM’s. but we have been saying everyone should learn to code for a while. Job on its way to being accomplished.

You don't think the law could basically make them infeasible? Right now they rely on leeching off content generated by real humans. Cut that off and they're going to have issues even training them.

Get something by Disney included in the training data by mistake and just watch what happens.

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