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Ask HN: How did you rebuild yourself after having hit rock bottom?

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Re: Ask HN: How did you rebuild yourself after having hit rock bottom?

#101

Post by sdoering »

crazygringo wrote: post #89

> I've also started therapy 2 months ago, but it's going slow and it hasn't been very useful yet. My #1 piece of advice is, find a new therapist. Therapy isn't one size fits all. You need to not only find the right type of "modality" for you (e.g. CBT and IFS* are worlds apart, generally you want somebody "integrative/eclectic" who will combine the right modalities for you), but you also simply need to find somebody…

This advice is golden. Please OP, listen. I can only second this.

There is so much truth in it, that even the German medical insurance system understood this and made it so that the first five sessions with a therapist are only for getting the feel of each other. Only after that you settle for the therapist or for "real" therapy (paid by the insurance). The first sessions are also paid, but you can switch until you find the right fit (if one can find an appointment in Germany, but that is another story).

So please, OP, look for someone more fitting.

Re: Ask HN: How did you rebuild yourself after having hit rock bottom?

#102

Post by Maro »

Hey man, don't worry, it will be all right!

About ~10 years ago in 2012-2013, within a ~6 month period (i) my startup [1] which I've been doing for 4 years failed / we shut it down (ii) my wife left me (we've been together for 7 years), and a few months later told me that she'd been cheating on me.

There was a ~6 month period when I was very depressed, sometimes I wasn't able to sleep for multiple nights in a row, and even when I got sleep, it was a few hours at best. It was a terrible period, I felt humiliated and reduced to nothing. I looked at my friends with stable boring jobs and families and thought that I messed up big time. I was so depressed, I even went to church a couple of times Sunday morning, because I couldn't sleep and I felt so sorry for myself, even though I'm an agnostic physicist.

Then something really unexpected happened: I got a job at a successful startup [2], which had great culture and lots of young people, and suddenly I was partying 2x a week with my new friends from work. While I was doing my own startup I stopped doing sports, so I picked up a +15 kg. The depression helped me lose most of it, and since I suddenly had a lot of free-time (no startup, no wife), I started doing sports again [3]. Even more unexpected, being divorced turned out to be appealing to ladies (I jokingly call it the "wounded deer pity phenomenon"), and I noticed ladies sending me signals, which helped my self-confidence get back on track.

Overall, in another ~6 months, to my huge surprise, there was a huge turn-around in my life, and in the end 2013 became one of the best years of my life! It was super-surprising, because it started on such a downer (Jan-6 was when my wife told me it's over, next day she moved out), but by Q3 I was hooked up with my girlfriend [4], feeling super happy at work and I even did another Ironman that year and beat my previous best by 2 hours!

So... it's completely normal to feel depressed in such situations. Just give it some time, build yourself up, and find a good social situation. I personally also started a Phd, which I didn't finish because of the aforementioned startup, but I don't want to tell you to do that. You can create positive vibes around you even by going to a co-working place 2x a week, doing some team sports, etc. Another thing that helps is going to therapy. It's completely normal to go, these days I do couple's therapy semi-regularly with my (current/2nd) wife.

-

[1] https://github.com/scalien/scaliendb

[2] Prezi

[3] triathlons

[4] later/currently wife, we have a beautiful 4 year old boy

Re: Ask HN: How did you rebuild yourself after having hit rock bottom?

#103

Post by graycat »

Early on, I noticed:

(1) There is actual reality.

(2) There is how you feel, your emotions.

While (1) and (2) can affect each other, the connections are weak and indirect, and, mostly, first cut, (1) and (2) are independent.

So, for things like doing well in some school work, getting a car repaired, having a good romantic relationship, getting the bank balance up, having money enough to buy a house, losing weight, ..., nearly all that is (1) and not (2).

Good news: If you get all the bugs out of some computer program, then the program will run the same whether you are feeling good or bad. That is, no matter how bad you feel, the program doesn't care and will run the same anyway. Sooo, that situation is a way to make progress in (1) even if are not doing well with (2), and that progress might help you do better with (2).

As an experienced programmer, you really CAN get the bugs out of that code and have the code run, no matter how bad you feel -- progress in (1) is right there, available to you, and it is sufficient for you just to get the bugs out of that code!!!

Uh, that you are able to write this query and post it here on Hacker News puts you way, Way, WAY ahead of maybe 80+% of the people alive today and 99.9+% of the people who have ever lived. A lot of those people were really happy, had good lives -- it's possible and has happened for many millions with much less in advantages than you have.

Uh, for romantic relationships, I tried to understand what worked, what didn't, and why. I settled on -- interruption, not everyone will agree -- one that works is driven heavily just by Darwin, and he wants (i) emotions, (ii) sex, (iii) pregnancy, all QUICKLY, and then return to (i) and do it all over again several times. If Darwin is disappointed, the relationship is on thin ice. In particular, please Darwin or don't be surprised to have the relationship fail. Sorry 'bout that.

A lot of things -- plans, activities, efforts, etc. -- are necessarily chancy. When trying such a thing, insist that it work, fairly well fairly quickly, or abandon the effort and try something else. That is, it's too easy to have lots of reasons why the effort really SHOULD work and, thus, continuing, for weeks, ..., years, decades trying to make the effort work. Fact of life: We don't know everything that is important; we don't understand all the details; we are really NOT in actual control. So, we give a good shot; if it works, terrific; if it doesn't, drop it and try something else. And by "give a good shot", don't bet too much; don't bet the farm; hopefully don't bet more than you can afford to lose.

Re: Ask HN: How did you rebuild yourself after having hit rock bottom?

#105

Post by sicp-enjoyer »

toomuchtodo wrote: post #100
sicp-enjoyer wrote: post #96

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Your comment cautioned against marriage for its "cost". Now you are talking about lifestyle preferences.

My apologies, sometimes I forget connecting the dots must be more explicit. Tell me the lifestyle of someone who has their assets split in half and having to provide alimony/maintenance for (possibly) the rest of their partner’s life. I can only speak for my circle of social acquaintances, many divorced, all living terrible lifestyles because of the financial burden of divorce. Some got away with only losing half the…

Now you're talking about financial burden again. I don't wish the situation you are describing on anyone, and I am sympathetic to making choices to avoid that happening. I don't think that is inconsistent with my other comments.

Just to add, here are a few other things that also limit your day to day freedom and add some risk of legal nightmares:

- operating a business

- owning a home or other building

- running for political office

- raising a child

- using a professional license (medical, law, civil engineer, etc)

Re: Ask HN: How did you rebuild yourself after having hit rock bottom?

#106

Post by wonderwonder »

toomuchtodo wrote: post #86
nyokodo wrote: post #81

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Marriages are fundamentally just a societal complication of a relationship - complete with dubious legal consequences and a not a sure thing that can end. Or, alternatively marriage is the fundamental glue of society and the germ of new life across the vastness of time and in basically every culture through disasters and war. One of these perspectives is fair to the most ancient institution.

Evolve or die. Marriage is an unnecessary burden and construct in modern times. Love, date, cohabitat (non community property state), but the failure rate is too high (~66% of marriages fail) when the cost is similarly high. Warren Buffett says the factor which most contributes to your future wealth is who you pick to marry. Do you feel lucky? https://www.amazon.com/Science-Happily-Ever-After-Enduring/d...

Or marry a good person, raise happy kids and live a good life together.

If you are not married and one partner makes significantly more than the other, what's to stop the wealthy partner just deciding 20 years into the relationship that they want a newer model and just leaving the former partner destitute? It creates a massive power discrepancy in the relationship. "Do what I want or I'll leave you in the street."

Married people work towards the same goal as a unit. Do whatever you want it's your life but marriage has very much been a net positive in my and my kids lives. I'm the primary earner in my relationship.

Re: Ask HN: How did you rebuild yourself after having hit rock bottom?

#109

Post by e0c5e7e »

>But most of the time in my life I've felt empty, doubting myself and struggling with a weak sense of self and unhealthy thought/behavioural patterns that are hard to shed off. I feel like I've lost any passion for anything, and don't know what I want or need.

You've got to look inward and figure yourself out - that could fix a lot of the other things you brought up.

If you know yourself and your ethics very well and you work hard to live them out, you're probably happy no matter your circumstances. Meditation or long boring walks can kind of open up your subconscious so you can start doing that; you can just wait until a random thought pops in your head and start pulling that thread, ask why you thought that, where's that coming from.

Also taking psych/life advice from strangers on the internet is pretty dangerous.

Re: Ask HN: How did you rebuild yourself after having hit rock bottom?

#110

Post by ncr100 »

Sounds like you are a sensitive, thoughtful and feeling individual. And you are reaching out to more people, strangers, presenting yourself as a massive pile of broken glass - a poetical description suggesting you'd like to talk about yourself in the context of a Feeling Thinking self-ideation. (ADVICE: you might want to naturally add more of that to your life, e.g. a regular poetry class, or write a daily Haiku, so EXPRESSING YOURSELF BECOMES YOUR LIFE.)

ADVICE: it's going to continue to require mindfulness, ongoing for the rest of your life in order to maintain the kind of mood-state that you desire.

Sounds like you label yourself as week and unhealthy thinking. Soooooo ADVICE ... challenge that as being "correct for the moment" and "maladaptive". It's still adaptation. And you've got a long life ahead of you to update your Stimulus > Response chain brain.

ADVICE: Look for healthy activities which support your mood - for me it's simple daily exercise - and look for thought-patterns that help "tank" you, with the aim of recognizing them when they pop up again. Counselor can help you recognize, "Oh that was a boost for me, I'll think about how to incorporate more of that into my routine."

ADVICE: Give therapy SIX MONTHS to show signs. AND tell the counselor the Criticism that you tell us, here, EVERY SESSION in some little or big way, for that six months, until it changes. The counselors can be there to guide YOUR thinking and action, not to do the living FOR YOU.

STORY A reason they could be saying "do things you like", is because you don't appear to do things you Truly like, from their perspective. Typically with children of Narcissists, the child's emotional needs are neglected. Sooooooooo you might be underdeveloped in a few ways around self-fulfillment. Google "CEN neglect narcissist". Accomplishments aside, what makes you happy, and what do you want?

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