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Ask HN: Is ageism in tech still a problem?

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Re: Ask HN: Is ageism in tech still a problem?

#11

Post by yieldcrv »

IAmBroom wrote: post #8
yieldcrv wrote: post #4

A lot of it involves masking and blending in by the candidate You can easily find an older person ranting against the idea of using full stack javascript, unaware of the V8 changes while still having some valid criticisms But then wonder if their rejection is ageism, instead of the rant just one example

I can provide more than just one example to back up any prejudice you can think of. Treating a person as part of a group is the problem. And when you are trying to isolate one person out of many, like for a job hire, it's not easy to avoid mass-filtering to speed it up.

There is tons of overfitting done by hiring managers

Re: Ask HN: Is ageism in tech still a problem?

#12

Post by AnimalMuppet »

In my sub-field (embedded systems), I don't see it. There are companies that see the value of 40 years of experience. (And there are plenty that don't...)

But the vibe I'm hearing lately is that junior engineers can't get jobs, because AI. I don't know if that reflects the reality (I haven't been trying to find a job as a junior in quite a while), but people are complaining about that these days.

Re: Ask HN: Is ageism in tech still a problem?

#13

Post by adamredwoods »

tuyguntn wrote: post #3

Yes, when 50 years old applies as a senior engineer, 25 years old senior engineers get uncomfortable. You might not notice it in any public conversation, but there is still a resistance: * will they be on-call? * can they work long hours? * how do I delegate to them? * are they going to resist new tech?

Recently, I've had a co-worker be "okay" with alerts in the middle of the night. I refused because I have to drive my child to school at 7.30am.

Re: Ask HN: Is ageism in tech still a problem?

#14

Post by jasonthorsness »

I observed engineers at all ages at many levels and roles (manager vs. IC) at Microsoft. To the point of us having retirement parties. I am sure ageism is real but part of the meme of "no software engineers over 40" is just the population curve of developers making them less common. And probably there's something broken with the recruiting pipelines.

Re: Ask HN: Is ageism in tech still a problem?

#17

Post by sokoloff »

IAmBroom wrote: post #8
yieldcrv wrote: post #4

A lot of it involves masking and blending in by the candidate You can easily find an older person ranting against the idea of using full stack javascript, unaware of the V8 changes while still having some valid criticisms But then wonder if their rejection is ageism, instead of the rant just one example

I can provide more than just one example to back up any prejudice you can think of. Treating a person as part of a group is the problem. And when you are trying to isolate one person out of many, like for a job hire, it's not easy to avoid mass-filtering to speed it up.

> Treating a person as part of a group is the problem.

Yes, but it's efficient and effective in a large number of cases.

Those with no programming experience is a group. Those who just graduated a CS program is a group. Fresh bootcamp grads are a group. People with 5+ years of experience with your tech stack are a group.

Is there someone with no programming experience who would turn out to be great? Of course; none of us were born with programming experience, but most people are practical enough to not bat an eye when we use past experience as a proxy to quickly pre-filter the possible candidate pool.

Re: Ask HN: Is ageism in tech still a problem?

#18

Post by guywithahat »

drillsteps5 wrote: post #9

Multiple issues. One of them is reluctance of younger hiring managers to hire older people. At 35 you don't necessarily see advantages that hiring 50 year old will bring you, as you don't have experience to be able to see that. Not sure if there is a "solution" for that as a 35 yo hiring manager will probably have an easier time managing under-35 individual contributor comparing to a 50 yo one. Different perspectives…

The irony is working with inexperienced senior engineers has absolutely made me see the benefits of hiring someone who's 50, the person who can't see the issue is the less-technical management doing the hiring who thinks having a PhD is the highest form of experience anyone can have.

Re: Ask HN: Is ageism in tech still a problem?

#19

Post by bob1029 »

josefritzishere wrote: post #6

The resistance I most often see is that companies are often hesitant to interview older candidates based on their assumptions around expected salary. This completely agnostic as to their actual fit for the role.

I've always been willing to start with zero compensation or benefits until to demonstrate my value and build trust.

It is rare that a company will take you up on that offer though. It really highlights what the money is actually about and how tribal "professional" "business" can be.

Re: Ask HN: Is ageism in tech still a problem?

#20

Post by georgeecollins »

Just wondering, was the issue not enough job hunters using the site or was the issue that not enough companies wanted to post listings. If the latter, I would guess that lots of people in tech recognize the problem, but not many companies (sincerely) want to do anything about it for all the reasons people here will give: worries about salary expectations, worries about availability to work long hours, less experienced people feeling uncomfortable managing more experienced people.
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