Ask HN: Is crypto still bad for the environment? • Hacker News Board

Re: Ask HN: Is crypto still bad for the environment?

#11

Post by kzzzznot » Tue, Apr 02, 2024, 3:13 PM UTC

logicalmonster wrote: post #7

1) The real answer might depend on the time-frame you're considering. In the short run, crypto does use up a good amount of electricity, which nobody disputes. But in the long-run, crypto fortunes being dependent on electricity prices probably puts a hell of a lot of financial pressure to emphasize the most efficient possible sources of power. Crypto creates its own financial award for those who promote capital inves…

3) The exact inverse is much more commonly visible - disingenuous promotion of crypto from those with vested interests

Re: Ask HN: Is crypto still bad for the environment?

#12

Post by i_rush_carriers » Tue, Apr 02, 2024, 4:55 PM UTC

Ekaros wrote: post #8

I would say it is waste on all levels. Proof of work on massive resource level. And proof of stake as wasted effort... Lot of time and human energy spend on it could likely be much better spend.

How is proof is stake wasted effort? What human energy is required there?

Re: Ask HN: Is crypto still bad for the environment?

#13

Post by i_rush_carriers » Tue, Apr 02, 2024, 4:59 PM UTC

logicalmonster wrote: post #7

1) The real answer might depend on the time-frame you're considering. In the short run, crypto does use up a good amount of electricity, which nobody disputes. But in the long-run, crypto fortunes being dependent on electricity prices probably puts a hell of a lot of financial pressure to emphasize the most efficient possible sources of power. Crypto creates its own financial award for those who promote capital inves…

Username checks out

I can agree with you on all points above, but why is it more important to keep freedom from tyranny instead of keeping our environment healthy? If climate change ruins the earth what’s the point of freedom anyway?

Re: Ask HN: Is crypto still bad for the environment?

#14

Post by i_rush_carriers » Tue, Apr 02, 2024, 5:00 PM UTC

kzzzznot wrote: post #11

logicalmonster wrote: post #7

1) The real answer might depend on the time-frame you're considering. In the short run, crypto does use up a good amount of electricity, which nobody disputes. But in the long-run, crypto fortunes being dependent on electricity prices probably puts a hell of a lot of financial pressure to emphasize the most efficient possible sources of power. Crypto creates its own financial award for those who promote capital inves…

3) The exact inverse is much more commonly visible - disingenuous promotion of crypto from those with vested interests

You’ve been burned by a few memecoins huh

Re: Ask HN: Is crypto still bad for the environment?

#15

Post by i_rush_carriers » Tue, Apr 02, 2024, 5:00 PM UTC

rbnsl wrote: post #6

Pretty sure it’s still the case from recent convos I’ve had with friends in crypto, it’s just no one talks about it anymore because crypto is massively unrelevant right now

How is crypto irrelevant? It’s been taking off the last 2 months

Re: Ask HN: Is crypto still bad for the environment?

#16

Post by i_rush_carriers » Tue, Apr 02, 2024, 5:01 PM UTC

moomoo11 wrote: post #5

It would be interesting if people (consumers mostly) could be charged for the type of compute they spend our energy production on. For example gamers, crypto fiends, people who stream content, etc. They should incur some extra charges for their compute spend. It’s for the planet and maybe we could break doomerism by pricing it out.

Don’t we uh, already pay for our electricity consumption?

Re: Ask HN: Is crypto still bad for the environment?

#17

Post by logicalmonster » Tue, Apr 02, 2024, 7:03 PM UTC

i_rush_carriers wrote: post #13

logicalmonster wrote: post #7

1) The real answer might depend on the time-frame you're considering. In the short run, crypto does use up a good amount of electricity, which nobody disputes. But in the long-run, crypto fortunes being dependent on electricity prices probably puts a hell of a lot of financial pressure to emphasize the most efficient possible sources of power. Crypto creates its own financial award for those who promote capital inves…

Username checks out I can agree with you on all points above, but why is it more important to keep freedom from tyranny instead of keeping our environment healthy? If climate change ruins the earth what’s the point of freedom anyway?

> I can agree with you on all points above, but why is it more important to keep freedom from tyranny instead of keeping our environment healthy?

Value is subjective, and anybody is entitled to prioritize the environment over any other values just as I'm free to prioritize freedom over anything else. I might just as well ask you what's the point of living in the most aesthetic prison? I don't know that there's an objectively right answer here, we're just speaking on different values.

> If climate change ruins the earth what’s the point of freedom anyway?

A lot of big science-related political disagreements in recent years stem from radically different (and in my opinion, wrong) risk-management decisions from people who (in my opinion) have almost always proven themselves to be wrong in a major way.

Based on everything I've learned in my life, I think the odds of normal human activity destroying the Earth are a very remote bet, and the odds of authoritarians who gain absolute power murdering many millions is a total guarantee.

IMO, while I don't think this would be a popular opinion on HN, I think humans face a far bigger risk from authoritarians than from climate change.

Re: Ask HN: Is crypto still bad for the environment?

#18

Post by useRust » Tue, Apr 02, 2024, 10:35 PM UTC

It really depends what value the project is bringing to the world. LLMs are using tons of energy but no one say it's waste because it's bringing values to the world. I think the right question to ask is are the crypto projects meaningful.