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Ask HN: Why aren't scientific journals free on the web?

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Re: Ask HN: Why aren't scientific journals free on the web?

#11

Post by mbreese »

What you're looking for are called "Open Access" journals. There are a few lists on the web, such as http://www.doaj.org/ . There has been a big push recently for Open Access to scientific data, especially NIH funded studies. I don't know how this is for NSF funded work though. PLoS is the poster child of this movement, but others have been around for longer, such as the BioMed Central (BMC) family of journals.

There are a lot of costs involved in the process of producing a scientific journal: printing, editing, hosting PDFs/supplemental data, etc... These are not insignificant costs. Usually the costs of this are split between the submitter and the subscriber (hence why sometimes articles include a disclaimer that they are an advertisement). Open Access journals will force these costs over to the submitter completely, leaving access to the articles free.

Re: Ask HN: Why aren't scientific journals free on the web?

#12

Post by mbreese »

bugsy wrote: post #8
RBerenguel wrote: post #2

Their purpose is to make money: they are not there for the sake of helping spread research (although it is an "useful byproduct").

I am not sure that is true. If it is true, then they are committing tax fraud since nearly every journal is published by a non-profit foundation or organization.

Non-profit doesn't mean free. Any money made from journals helps support their core missions.

Re: Ask HN: Why aren't scientific journals free on the web?

#13

Post by tomjen3 »

Because they can. Peer-review publications are the way people measure the worthiness of academics, so their producers job depend on getting published in prestigious scientific journals, so they put up with it.

The only way this is ever going to chance is if they make the law such that you have to publish in a free to access journal, but since the current mafia has all the money, who do you think has the most lobbyists?

Re: Ask HN: Why aren't scientific journals free on the web?

#14

Post by clp16 »

mbreese wrote: post #11

What you're looking for are called "Open Access" journals. There are a few lists on the web, such as http://www.doaj.org/ . There has been a big push recently for Open Access to scientific data, especially NIH funded studies. I don't know how this is for NSF funded work though. PLoS is the poster child of this movement, but others have been around for longer, such as the BioMed Central (BMC) family of journals. There…

If these costs are forced over to the submitter, the stereotypical "money-ignoring" researcher, those costs will begin the weigh heavily on their shoulders. Without support from their hosting institutions, which means a change in how business is done, those articles might find themselves with small, yet significant price tags. Look at textbooks.

Re: Ask HN: Why aren't scientific journals free on the web?

#15

Post by mhluongo »

tomjen3 wrote: post #13

Because they can. Peer-review publications are the way people measure the worthiness of academics, so their producers job depend on getting published in prestigious scientific journals, so they put up with it. The only way this is ever going to chance is if they make the law such that you have to publish in a free to access journal, but since the current mafia has all the money, who do you think has the most lobbyist…

If an open-access journal can become reputable enough, the niche in a field interested in the journal will publish there- period. It doesn't require laws to be passed.

Re: Ask HN: Why aren't scientific journals free on the web?

#16

Post by pbh »

A fairly detailed (if opinionated) answer to your question is here:

http://www.zephoria.org/thoughts/archives/2008/02/06/openacc...

The summary is: (1) academics have historically given away their research and reviewing work for free to (revenue seeking) journals and professional associations to get distribution and prestige, (2) this no longer makes sense with the Internet, and (3) academia, journals, and professional associations are in an awkward transition as a result.

In the meantime, just use Google Scholar and hope that you are reading something important enough that someone has possibly violated copyright and posted a version online without a paywall.

Re: Ask HN: Why aren't scientific journals free on the web?

#17

Post by mhluongo »

mbreese wrote: post #12
bugsy wrote: post #8

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I am not sure that is true. If it is true, then they are committing tax fraud since nearly every journal is published by a non-profit foundation or organization.

Non-profit doesn't mean free. Any money made from journals helps support their core missions.

But their main purpose is no longer "to make money".

Re: Ask HN: Why aren't scientific journals free on the web?

#18

Post by mhluongo »

mhluongo wrote: post #10

My understanding is that the problem with making scientific journals freely available is usually one of reputation. Reputable journals need strong peer review and editing, which isn't always free. Further, until a journal is reputable, few people want to publish in it. In the US, all works funded by the National Institute of Health (NIH) are required to be made freely available to the public within one (?) year of pu…

For the products of funding by NIH, see PubMed - http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/

Re: Ask HN: Why aren't scientific journals free on the web?

#19

Post by clp16 »

pbh wrote: post #16

A fairly detailed (if opinionated) answer to your question is here: http://www.zephoria.org/thoughts/archives/2008/02/06/openacc... The summary is: (1) academics have historically given away their research and reviewing work for free to (revenue seeking) journals and professional associations to get distribution and prestige, (2) this no longer makes sense with the Internet, and (3) academia, journals, and profession…

Google Scholar isn't an answer to the free publications question.

Re: Ask HN: Why aren't scientific journals free on the web?

#20

Post by uberuberuber »

I work for a medical association that publishes a top-100 journal (I work on different products, not the journal), and we have ~20 full time staff members internally working on it. Actual delivery of web content is handled by an outside vendor with their own staff. Tack on the declining $ available from advertising, plus ever more onerous pharma restrictions and there is no way that the content could be delivered for free.
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