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Ask HN: Okay okay, I'll learn to program...now what?

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Re: Ask HN: Okay okay, I'll learn to program...now what?

#11

Post by metamemetics »

augustflanagan wrote: post #8
metamemetics wrote: post #5

Python. Do not do the official guide. Do not read the documentation. Do something that forces you to program examples of increasing difficulty. In short, do this course: http://cs.northwestern.edu/~akuzma/classes/EECS110-s10/index... All the labs and assignments are online. You get to make maze solvers, generate fractals, implement Conway's Game of Life, lots of genuinely fun stuff. Just work through it and tell your…

If you do start with Python I found Zed Shaw's Learn Python The Hard Way to be incredibly helpful when I first started learning to code some months ago. http://learnpythonthehardway.org/

I like the link I posted because it's an intro to Computer Science in addition to Python. So in addition to introducing more and more complex Python, the problems you have to solve are meant to symbolize actual areas of CS research instead of text-based adventure game development.

And your code often gets to control graphical libraries to spice things up.

Re: Ask HN: Okay okay, I'll learn to program...now what?

#12

Post by jacoblyles »

mechanical_fish wrote: post #2

You need to decide what you want to build, or at least what you want to build first. From CSS, an obvious way to go is Javascript or PHP, or better yet both. If you think that you don't want to build a specific thing, but instead want a birds-eye armchair view of the essence of what programming is about, don't waste time; try SICP: http://groups.csail.mit.edu/mac/classes/6.001/abelson-sussma... But odds are that you'…

Someone told me to try SICP when I was first trying to learn how to program and it was an incredibly frustrating and deflating experience.

The process goes something like this: Okay, SICP sounds good. They're using LISP. How do I make a LISP program? The internet says SLIME is THE way to go and I'd be an idiot to try any other development environment. Ok, I guess I'll just install that... (3 weeks later)... okay that didn't work. Screw this, I'm learning PHP.

Re: Ask HN: Okay okay, I'll learn to program...now what?

#13

Post by metamemetics »

techiferous wrote: post #10

If you're looking to do a web startup, ditch your Windows computer. Get a Mac or a Linux machine.

You should give him reasons why.

Personally I find Win7 has a far superior interface to OSX and out-of-box linux distros if you like using your keyboard and a minimal\no-shortcut desktop. The taskbar looks great left-aligned which, ideal for widescreen monitors. To open any program all you have to do is press the Windows key on your keyboard and type 2 or 3 letters for an autocomplete to find it, then press enter. No menus or shortcuts necessary. The only downside is installing CygWin for BASH, but I'd rather do that than install WINE for Adobe.

Re: Ask HN: Okay okay, I'll learn to program...now what?

#14

Post by dpcan »

Pick a project first, something that you would love to FINISH. Then research the best language to use to reach that goal.

That being said, when I started, I made due with what I had. QBasic. Then a borland C compiler. Then Java. And then I just started experimenting.

It didn't matter to me, I just loved to create things.

Bottom line... you have to love building a complicated puzzle and you have to be able to drive yourself to finish a project.

This "okay okay" business basically says to me.... you're in trouble already.

Re: Ask HN: Okay okay, I'll learn to program...now what?

#15

Post by iterationx »

You want to do the minimum work to accomplish your goal (life is short), not learn a programming language for pedantic purposes. I'm using OfBiz, a Java web framework, right now, and its suitable for my purposes, but I don't know what your objectives are. You may be interested in Ruby, Django, Tapestry or ASP.

Re: Ask HN: Okay okay, I'll learn to program...now what?

#16

Post by aaronbrethorst »

jacoblyles wrote: post #12
mechanical_fish wrote: post #2

You need to decide what you want to build, or at least what you want to build first. From CSS, an obvious way to go is Javascript or PHP, or better yet both. If you think that you don't want to build a specific thing, but instead want a birds-eye armchair view of the essence of what programming is about, don't waste time; try SICP: http://groups.csail.mit.edu/mac/classes/6.001/abelson-sussma... But odds are that you'…

Someone told me to try SICP when I was first trying to learn how to program and it was an incredibly frustrating and deflating experience. The process goes something like this: Okay, SICP sounds good. They're using LISP. How do I make a LISP program? The internet says SLIME is THE way to go and I'd be an idiot to try any other development environment. Ok, I guess I'll just install that... (3 weeks later)... okay that…

Dr. Scheme might have made things easier. Especially because SICP uses Scheme and not Lisp.

That said, the first term of my freshman year of college used SICP as the textbook. I banged my head against a wall for the first six weeks and had an epiphany in week 7. It's the best feeling in the world when functional programming finally makes sense.

Re: Ask HN: Okay okay, I'll learn to program...now what?

#17

Post by [deleted] »

aaronbrethorst wrote: post #16
jacoblyles wrote: post #12

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Someone told me to try SICP when I was first trying to learn how to program and it was an incredibly frustrating and deflating experience. The process goes something like this: Okay, SICP sounds good. They're using LISP. How do I make a LISP program? The internet says SLIME is THE way to go and I'd be an idiot to try any other development environment. Ok, I guess I'll just install that... (3 weeks later)... okay that…

Dr. Scheme might have made things easier. Especially because SICP uses Scheme and not Lisp. That said, the first term of my freshman year of college used SICP as the textbook. I banged my head against a wall for the first six weeks and had an epiphany in week 7. It's the best feeling in the world when functional programming finally makes sense.

[deleted]

Re: Ask HN: Okay okay, I'll learn to program...now what?

#18

Post by weaksauce »

dpcan wrote: post #14

Pick a project first, something that you would love to FINISH. Then research the best language to use to reach that goal. That being said, when I started, I made due with what I had. QBasic. Then a borland C compiler. Then Java. And then I just started experimenting. It didn't matter to me, I just loved to create things. Bottom line... you have to love building a complicated puzzle and you have to be able to drive yo…

Damn iPad and my fat fingers voted you down. Sorry mate. Good advice otherwise. Once I get off my iPad I'll search for the python tetris project that is pretty good for people in his situation. I agree a project is essential.

Re: Ask HN: Okay okay, I'll learn to program...now what?

#19

Post by kranner »

metamemetics wrote: post #13
techiferous wrote: post #10

If you're looking to do a web startup, ditch your Windows computer. Get a Mac or a Linux machine.

You should give him reasons why. Personally I find Win7 has a far superior interface to OSX and out-of-box linux distros if you like using your keyboard and a minimal\no-shortcut desktop. The taskbar looks great left-aligned which, ideal for widescreen monitors. To open any program all you have to do is press the Windows key on your keyboard and type 2 or 3 letters for an autocomplete to find it, then press enter. No…

OS X has the Spotlight which people use in the same way: one hot-key, two letters to find your app by name, and enter.

Re: Ask HN: Okay okay, I'll learn to program...now what?

#20

Post by jacoblyles »

aaronbrethorst wrote: post #16
jacoblyles wrote: post #12

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Someone told me to try SICP when I was first trying to learn how to program and it was an incredibly frustrating and deflating experience. The process goes something like this: Okay, SICP sounds good. They're using LISP. How do I make a LISP program? The internet says SLIME is THE way to go and I'd be an idiot to try any other development environment. Ok, I guess I'll just install that... (3 weeks later)... okay that…

Dr. Scheme might have made things easier. Especially because SICP uses Scheme and not Lisp. That said, the first term of my freshman year of college used SICP as the textbook. I banged my head against a wall for the first six weeks and had an epiphany in week 7. It's the best feeling in the world when functional programming finally makes sense.

Everything is hard in Scheme/LISP world. As a first programming project for an isolated person without collaborators or teachers, SICP is death. It will be months before the autodidact can accomplish something that he can feel proud of. Nothing will kill interest faster than beating your head against the wall in isolation for months in your spare time without any tangible progress.

I believe people that say it's awesome and I look forward to tackling it someday. But it is not a good way for a person to dip his first toe into programming.

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