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Ask HN: Self taught programmers without CS degree working at one of the big 5?

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11–20 of 23 posts

Re: Ask HN: Self taught programmers without CS degree working at one of the big 5?

#11
post #8

I start at Apple tomorrow - unfortunately I can't really say much about it except that my industry experience and experience interviewing with a myriad of companies helped prepare me for the interview process at Apple, although Apple is pretty intense as far as interviews go (I only study interview failures). While I am self-taught and without a CS degree, I did spend 4 years at a top 15 PhD program in mathematics (U…

Congratulations! as a front-end engineer, did you also have to master Algorithms and Data Structures to be able to get into Apple?

Re: Ask HN: Self taught programmers without CS degree working at one of the big 5?

#12
Self taught programmer WITH a CS degree, worked at 2 of the companies you mentioned. I got a master's degree in CS a while ago. I still call myself a self taught programmer because I started learning as soon as I started practicing CS at work. A degree is like a passeport, hard to move around without it and people assume you do have a passeport because it's easy to get.

So, it could be just a memory exercise. If you practice on leetcode and memorize about a 100 different problems, then you should be able to get in any of these companies (as illustrated by other people here).

Last but not least, to really answer your question, you basically feel pressured to deliver a lot in a small period of time. Not once, not twice, always. You get judged a lot on your abilities and at the end of the day, you still work on products that solve very basic problems - web app, mobile app, e-commerce, social, etc.

It's all about fear and ego. Was I able to work at one of these top companies? Am I the smartest employee in my group? Is my annual package bigger than my friends packages? Am I wearing a t-shirt of my employer during the weekends? Things like that... from experience, you should be hunting for a much bigger opportunity in life. Go where things don't exist yet and don't get distracted by very successful people like zuck, jobs, gates, etc. who have built empires. Do you want to work for their missions or yours? Use them as examples, don't work for them!

Re: Ask HN: Self taught programmers without CS degree working at one of the big 5?

#13
post #8

I start at Apple tomorrow - unfortunately I can't really say much about it except that my industry experience and experience interviewing with a myriad of companies helped prepare me for the interview process at Apple, although Apple is pretty intense as far as interviews go (I only study interview failures). While I am self-taught and without a CS degree, I did spend 4 years at a top 15 PhD program in mathematics (U…

Did you answer your interview questions in Javascript? Seeing that you are a front end dev.

Re: Ask HN: Self taught programmers without CS degree working at one of the big 5?

#14
I don't have a CS degree and work at Amazon. I picked a specialty completely unrelated to academic CS that's generally welcoming of beginners (PHP development).

After getting a very entry level PHP job based on reading a few O'Reilly books, I spent a couple years getting progressively less shitty jobs with progressively higher pay and levels of responsibility. By the time I got an interview with Amazon, I was a legitimate PHP expert. I read a book on Amazon's leadership principles and worked through Cracking the Coding Interview to prep for my interview loop at Amazon, and I'm pretty sure only one or two of my interviewers knew I didn't have a CS degree -- the rest didn't look at my resume.

Now that I've been at Amazon for two years, I don't think any employer would care about my lack of a CS degree. I'm certainly happy to be making several times more than I did in my previous career (French teacher).

Re: Ask HN: Self taught programmers without CS degree working at one of the big 5?

#15
post #3

I don't have a CS degree and currently work at Google. I used a bootcamp to get my foot in the door. I studied college textbooks in my spare time for a few years to fill some of the gaps in my knowledge, and then hardcore interview prepped for a few months leading up to my interviews. I got accepted into all of the tech giants and ultimately decided to go to Google. This is by far the best job I've ever had, and I co…

Out of interest, how did you go about actually getting the interviews?

Unlike you, I have a CS degree, and I've applied to the top five a few times now. Microsoft and Amazon contacted me, and after I agreed to an interview they both went quiet. Facebook never got back, and Google rejected me twice after sending in my CV.

I've tried a number of ways, through LinkedIn, direct applications, and even asking face-to-face at conferences, but it feels like I've angered some almighty tech god because none of them seem remotely interested, or are happy to tease me with an interview, only to ignore me after I reply.

I've always assumed that if it's this hard for me, then it must be as hard, or harder for others, so it'd be interesting to hear about the actual process of getting an interview from your perspective.

Re: Ask HN: Self taught programmers without CS degree working at one of the big 5?

#16
post #9
post #4

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What resources did you use links will be helpful and how long did it take from Bootcamp to Google

Took me about 2.5 years, but I wasn't actively trying to get into a tech giant the entire time. I personally know people who went straight from a bootcamp into Google/Amazon/Facebook because their ability to solve algorithms was excellent. I have a copy of CLRS on my desk, but I actually found Algorithms 4th ed to be the perfect level of difficulty for someone with no math or CS background.

>I actually found Algorithms 4th ed to be the perfect level of difficulty

This book - http://algs4.cs.princeton.edu/home/ ?

Re: Ask HN: Self taught programmers without CS degree working at one of the big 5?

#17
post #16
post #9

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Took me about 2.5 years, but I wasn't actively trying to get into a tech giant the entire time. I personally know people who went straight from a bootcamp into Google/Amazon/Facebook because their ability to solve algorithms was excellent. I have a copy of CLRS on my desk, but I actually found Algorithms 4th ed to be the perfect level of difficulty for someone with no math or CS background.

>I actually found Algorithms 4th ed to be the perfect level of difficulty This book - http://algs4.cs.princeton.edu/home/ ?

Yep! That's the exact one I have.

Re: Ask HN: Self taught programmers without CS degree working at one of the big 5?

#18
post #15
post #3

I don't have a CS degree and currently work at Google. I used a bootcamp to get my foot in the door. I studied college textbooks in my spare time for a few years to fill some of the gaps in my knowledge, and then hardcore interview prepped for a few months leading up to my interviews. I got accepted into all of the tech giants and ultimately decided to go to Google. This is by far the best job I've ever had, and I co…

Out of interest, how did you go about actually getting the interviews? Unlike you, I have a CS degree, and I've applied to the top five a few times now. Microsoft and Amazon contacted me, and after I agreed to an interview they both went quiet. Facebook never got back, and Google rejected me twice after sending in my CV. I've tried a number of ways, through LinkedIn, direct applications, and even asking face-to-face…

I'm honestly not sure what to tell you - the recruiting side of things is so opaque that I'm not sure what you can do to get past the initial screen. I personally had a strong referral at Google, but everywhere else I applied through the front door and had no issues.

If I were to take a guess, I'd say that I got a bit lucky - right place/right time sort of thing. I had a few years of experience under my belt, which separated me from the new grads, but not so many years of experience that I'd be competing with senior engineers. On top of that, I applied for front end positions, which I think tech giants have only recently started to value - this has left a bit of a void that needs to be filled, which possibly made it easier for me to get the initial recruiter calls.

My resume was also relatively strong for someone with two years of experience. Solid university, strong GPA, and at my previous jobs I always tried my best to wiggle myself into taking on large projects and write tooling to make everyone's lives easier. This gave me a lot of stuff to talk about during the interviews and made for some impressive looking bullet points.

Re: Ask HN: Self taught programmers without CS degree working at one of the big 5?

#19
post #3

I don't have a CS degree and currently work at Google. I used a bootcamp to get my foot in the door. I studied college textbooks in my spare time for a few years to fill some of the gaps in my knowledge, and then hardcore interview prepped for a few months leading up to my interviews. I got accepted into all of the tech giants and ultimately decided to go to Google. This is by far the best job I've ever had, and I co…

Are you into frontend/backend? Also, Do frontend interviews require that the algorithms be done in Javascript?

Re: Ask HN: Self taught programmers without CS degree working at one of the big 5?

#20

Self taught programmer WITH a CS degree, worked at 2 of the companies you mentioned. I got a master's degree in CS a while ago. I still call myself a self taught programmer because I started learning as soon as I started practicing CS at work. A degree is like a passeport, hard to move around without it and people assume you do have a passeport because it's easy to get. So, it could be just a memory exercise. If you…

This is the same impression I got by interviewing at the big 5. Everybody there drinks the Koolaid while building things that have a negative impact on the world
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