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Ask HN: Do wellness incentives help employers save money on taxes and insurance?

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Re: Ask HN: Do wellness incentives help employers save money on taxes and insurance?

#11

Post by superuser2 »

feld wrote: post #10

It's a privacy invasion scam. At a previous employer they wanted to track our steps and our GPS location and also wanted us to record every glass of water we drink. It's a disgusting ruse. I don't care if they were going to give me $300/yr, my privacy is worth more than that.

Would you expect someone to write you flood insurance on a house without knowing where that house is located?

Should car insurance companies treat a 16 year old with a WRX and a 45 year old with a Camry as equivalent?

It's really pretty bizarre that we expect people to underwrite our health without any insight into what risks we choose to take with it.

We chose the free market as our approach to health insurance, we could at least make it efficient. Right now a lot of healthy, fit people are paying through the nose to subsidize the privacy of those with sedentary lifestyles.

Re: Ask HN: Do wellness incentives help employers save money on taxes and insurance?

#12

Post by radnam »

theforceawakens wrote: post #8

(Hope this helps someone like me.) Here is a link I was able to find that throws some light on Tax Benefits/Implications: https://www.shrm.org/legalissues/federalresources/pages/fede... Still looking for info on Insurance Benefits. (That seems to be a murky area....any info would be very helpful.)

I have been meaning to look into this area for a while so pleasant surprise to see this on HN. I don't have particular insight on this particular topic but I am working on startup to improve wellness and reducing friction to access of care. Feel free to shoot me an email (rahurkar@gmail.com) if you are interested in this area as well.

Re: Ask HN: Do wellness incentives help employers save money on taxes and insurance?

#13

Post by erbo »

feld wrote: post #10

It's a privacy invasion scam. At a previous employer they wanted to track our steps and our GPS location and also wanted us to record every glass of water we drink. It's a disgusting ruse. I don't care if they were going to give me $300/yr, my privacy is worth more than that.

Agreed. The state of my health is between me, my doctor, and maybe my fiancee. AND NO ONE ELSE. Certainly not my employer, or anyone connected to them.

They may claim they protect the privacy of your information, but recent history has shown that those claims generally aren't worth the electrons they're written with. There will be leaks, and hacks, and all manner of subterfuge.

Re: Ask HN: Do wellness incentives help employers save money on taxes and insurance?

#14

Post by theforceawakens »

feld wrote: post #10

It's a privacy invasion scam. At a previous employer they wanted to track our steps and our GPS location and also wanted us to record every glass of water we drink. It's a disgusting ruse. I don't care if they were going to give me $300/yr, my privacy is worth more than that.

Orthogonal issue but here is what I think -- While I agree that privacy is of great concern, I do think the way to approach this would be with more frequent health checkups. Our body is the best marker at the end of the day to measure our healthiness. Everything else doesn't matter, which is also the reason the allure of wearables is wearing out. (It's great, but what do you do now that you have all this data that you have gathered?)

Re: Ask HN: Do wellness incentives help employers save money on taxes and insurance?

#15

Post by theforceawakens »

npace12 wrote: post #6
theforceawakens wrote: post #4

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Thanks so much. Is there any documentation online that you know of which has more information?

I don't unfortunately. The discount/credit requirements can vary a lot from what I've seen though. Some companies require you to do certain things like track certain vitals, while others just want a PHA filled out. Those goals are usually passed on to employees in the form of gift cards/cash in order to incentivize them to actually do these things. The product we built was effectively a CMS that allows it to be custo…

Thanks. From your info, I was able to surface that there could be tax implications (if the incentives are offered as non-fringe/taxable benefits), from an employee standpoint.

Re: Ask HN: Do wellness incentives help employers save money on taxes and insurance?

#16

Post by emodendroket »

6stringmerc wrote: post #9

If you look a little deeper, the foundation of the concept of "Wellness Programs" is to raise all rates paid by employees across the board, then provide discounts for behaviors that are approved (basically sharing PMI data with a 3rd party). In the US this is because - to my understanding - laws prevent insurance companies and companies from 'discriminating' in their pricing. As in, they can't penalize most people fo…

> As in, healthier diet of fresh foods, better rest at night, free access to exercise facilities.

Well of course not; it might cost the company money to make those things available.

Re: Ask HN: Do wellness incentives help employers save money on taxes and insurance?

#17

Post by emodendroket »

theforceawakens wrote: post #14
feld wrote: post #10

It's a privacy invasion scam. At a previous employer they wanted to track our steps and our GPS location and also wanted us to record every glass of water we drink. It's a disgusting ruse. I don't care if they were going to give me $300/yr, my privacy is worth more than that.

Orthogonal issue but here is what I think -- While I agree that privacy is of great concern, I do think the way to approach this would be with more frequent health checkups. Our body is the best marker at the end of the day to measure our healthiness. Everything else doesn't matter, which is also the reason the allure of wearables is wearing out. (It's great, but what do you do now that you have all this data that yo…

Yeah but how? There aren't enough primary care doctors and the work is being farmed out to nurse practitioners and physician's assistants (and anyone who says the quality of care is just the same hasn't experienced it)

Re: Ask HN: Do wellness incentives help employers save money on taxes and insurance?

#18

Post by theforceawakens »

6stringmerc wrote: post #9

If you look a little deeper, the foundation of the concept of "Wellness Programs" is to raise all rates paid by employees across the board, then provide discounts for behaviors that are approved (basically sharing PMI data with a 3rd party). In the US this is because - to my understanding - laws prevent insurance companies and companies from 'discriminating' in their pricing. As in, they can't penalize most people fo…

Thanks for the insight. I think you bring a very good perspective to this.

Although I am not very sure, what you really mean by saying "a lot of lifestyle changes needed to promote genuine health aren't really incorporated"...do you mean the employers don't promote them? Or the incentives you are relating to don't fall under the "wellness program" benefits in general to receive a credit/discount (from the standpoint of insurance companies)?

Re: Ask HN: Do wellness incentives help employers save money on taxes and insurance?

#19

Post by emodendroket »

superuser2 wrote: post #11
feld wrote: post #10

It's a privacy invasion scam. At a previous employer they wanted to track our steps and our GPS location and also wanted us to record every glass of water we drink. It's a disgusting ruse. I don't care if they were going to give me $300/yr, my privacy is worth more than that.

Would you expect someone to write you flood insurance on a house without knowing where that house is located? Should car insurance companies treat a 16 year old with a WRX and a 45 year old with a Camry as equivalent? It's really pretty bizarre that we expect people to underwrite our health without any insight into what risks we choose to take with it. We chose the free market as our approach to health insurance, we…

Does your car insurance company require you to install a GPS tracker in your car so they can keep track of everywhere you go? Because that would be much more analogous to what the parent describes.

Re: Ask HN: Do wellness incentives help employers save money on taxes and insurance?

#20

Post by mikecb »

emodendroket wrote: post #19
superuser2 wrote: post #11

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Would you expect someone to write you flood insurance on a house without knowing where that house is located? Should car insurance companies treat a 16 year old with a WRX and a 45 year old with a Camry as equivalent? It's really pretty bizarre that we expect people to underwrite our health without any insight into what risks we choose to take with it. We chose the free market as our approach to health insurance, we…

Does your car insurance company require you to install a GPS tracker in your car so they can keep track of everywhere you go? Because that would be much more analogous to what the parent describes.

No, but many of them give you a discount for installing an accelerometer/gps speed sensor.
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