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Ask HN: As an employer, what do you wish applicants did more often?

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Ask HN: As an employer, what do you wish applicants did more often?

#1
I have been job hunting for the better part of six months. Although it is disappointing that the market is overwhelmingly biased towards web developers and I've yet to receive a single offer, what has irked me most is the apparent lowered standard of courtesy and care displayed by some employers, with larger companies more likely to be offenders. (Going into an interview without really studying a candidate's resume, being disappointed that a new graduate doesn't have more professional experience, taking much too long between correspondence, not notifying of rejection after interview, etc...)

Yes, employers more often than not have much more on their plate than applicants, but having passed through enough of the screening process to have a face-to-face interview for a position starting ASAP, I can't help but feel offended when the other party do not have the courtesy to say "Sorry; good luck."

But, enough of that: I would like to get the other point of view.

As an employer, what are some of the things you wish applicants did more of to make the whole process smoother and generally more pleasant for everybody involved?

Re: Ask HN: As an employer, what do you wish applicants did more often?

#3
Hi Yang,

I would recommend putting some personal pics of you and your friend’s mountain biking on your webpage. It will make you come across a little different than the other candidates.

Also, the page looks very 1998-notepad-hand-coded html. Not the best calling card for a computer geek dude. Go get some Dreamweaver time somewhere and make a nice layout. Focus on an eye pleasing font and page color. If you are not layout talented look into using one of the templates out there on the web. Make it nice and professional then add some fun interesting looking personal pics and head your resume with your webpage address. It might help your job prospects.

http://yangman.ca/

Re: Ask HN: As an employer, what do you wish applicants did more often?

#4

Hi Yang, I would recommend putting some personal pics of you and your friend’s mountain biking on your webpage. It will make you come across a little different than the other candidates. Also, the page looks very 1998-notepad-hand-coded html. Not the best calling card for a computer geek dude. Go get some Dreamweaver time somewhere and make a nice layout. Focus on an eye pleasing font and page color. If you are not l…

I'm in a similar situation as the author, looking for my first full-time job (I'm graduating this spring). So, I guess my opinion doesn't count for much.

But I still think it's sad that someone's personal home page must be directed by the current perception of what's the "cool" thing to do (for that matter, using Dreamweaver is more what the "cool" thing was in the late 90s). A plain HTML page says "open-source hacker". But it only says that to other hackers, so this will only help you if the person doing the hiring is technical. A "generic HR person" might prefer a "generic stock template".

Re: Ask HN: As an employer, what do you wish applicants did more often?

#5
I do technical hiring for my company. Here's a bunch of things that I personally like to see -- may not apply to larger, non-startup employers though.

* mention in the initial e-mail whether you're applying as local or remote

* mention in the initial e-mail your availability (immediate, two weeks on notification, etc)

* have a non-generic cover letter/e-mail that shows me you spent at least a couple minutes finding out about my company and tailoring your application to match

* don't namedrop languages in resumes: namedrop libraries/APIs you're familiar with

* pdf, text, or webpage: no .doc

* if asked to provide code in an archive, don't splatter files inside my pwd (I open in /tmp anyway, but it's still annoying)

* if asked to provide code, vendor everything you can (ie make your code as self-contained as possible) and provide a README for how to get it up and running

I like your page at http://yangman.ca but it would be better if you went into detail about what you did for the various projects. Don't say you "actively contribute" to the radeonhd project -- describe 2 or 3 of your major contributions.

Another suggestion: make use of the fact your resume is web-based. Instead of linking directly to linkedin etc, link to a uri on your domain which redirects. That way you can find out your clickthrough rate, and alter your online profile accordingly. For example, if no one ever clicks your LinkedIn profile, you may want to put your employment history on the page itself. If you apply to companies in different locations, you can roughly figure out which ones look at which pages via a geoip lookup.

Re: Ask HN: As an employer, what do you wish applicants did more often?

#6
These are very basic, but here goes -

* Most interviewers, especially at big companies, don't take the time to read a resume in detail. Also, it is usually difficult to access websites if all they have is a hard copy of your resume. Make it easy for the interviewer to access your work during the interview. Use a URL shortener and have links ready to - your online resume with links, rich info (images, charts) about your work etc. It helps to be prepared if the interviewer brings along a laptop. Talking someone through your work when they are looking at it is always better than just talking about it.

* Research the company before the interview. It's always a red flag if a candidate doesn't have any questions about the company they are about to work for. The more you can show the interviewer that you've done your homework, the more likely they are to consider you seriously.

* If possible, learn more about your interviewer before the interview. Google and LinkedIn are your friends. It helps to have some context.

All the best!

Re: Ask HN: As an employer, what do you wish applicants did more often?

#7
post #6

These are very basic, but here goes - * Most interviewers, especially at big companies, don't take the time to read a resume in detail. Also, it is usually difficult to access websites if all they have is a hard copy of your resume. Make it easy for the interviewer to access your work during the interview. Use a URL shortener and have links ready to - your online resume with links, rich info (images, charts) about yo…

URL shorteners are bullshit, no one should ever use them. Progress on the URL front is to make them human readable and less obfuscated. It is easier to type five english words and a domain name than five meaningless letters and numbers, plus they tell the user where they're going.

For example, I bet you don't appreciate clicking on this link: http://bit.ly/f4OF , whereas http://www.1man1jar.com/ tells you everything you need to know, and it's easier to transfer from a piece of paper to your short term memory to the URL bar in your web browser.

Re: Ask HN: As an employer, what do you wish applicants did more often?

#8
post #4

Hi Yang, I would recommend putting some personal pics of you and your friend’s mountain biking on your webpage. It will make you come across a little different than the other candidates. Also, the page looks very 1998-notepad-hand-coded html. Not the best calling card for a computer geek dude. Go get some Dreamweaver time somewhere and make a nice layout. Focus on an eye pleasing font and page color. If you are not l…

I'm in a similar situation as the author, looking for my first full-time job (I'm graduating this spring). So, I guess my opinion doesn't count for much. But I still think it's sad that someone's personal home page must be directed by the current perception of what's the "cool" thing to do (for that matter, using Dreamweaver is more what the "cool" thing was in the late 90s). A plain HTML page says "open-source hacke…

It's about differentiation.

Sure, you're looking to get hired for your code chops - and your employer is looking to hire you for your code chops, but in a sea of new grads something has to make you stand out. Given that traditionally hackers have been very bad at design, UI, and aesthetics, being one who isn't blind to these virtues is very valuable indeed.

And image is everything, especially when trying to get hired.

I think the submitter is off to a good start - he doesn't portray himself as the stereotypical hacker. He's active, he loves mountain biking, and his life doesn't revolve around sitting in front of the terminal. Great. Having sifted through piles 'o resumes before, I can tell you he's already on the top half (yeah, it really is that simple to get in the top half of the pile, especially for new grads). Oh, it's not just the mountain biking, it's the fact that he appears to have substantial actual code experience (as opposed to "I took a class on that").

Uhoh, I think this about to turn into a short essay:

For the submitter: I grew up in Metro Vancouver, and before graduation I did make a concerted effort to find code jobs there - the pickings are truly slim. Have you applied to jobs out east? Toronto, Montreal, and Ottawa are all epicentres for tech jobs in Canada - far moreso than Vancouver. Also do not neglect the good old US of A, as a Canadian citizen getting a TN visa is almost trivial so long as you have a job offer. Oh, and for some odd reason Nova Scotia is also pretty rich in programming jobs...

I see you went to SFU and seem to have a co-op term of experience - this is good, but to be perfectly honest may not cut it against other candidates who have more fleshed out co-op experiences through university. Your cards have been dealt and you must play them, but remember this as a potential comparative weakness and try spin your open source contributions more strongly.

To address your concerns directly from my own pre-grad job hunting experience (as well as 6 co-op terms of sometimes insanely difficult job hunting): do not expect companies to call you back, or be overly timely on most contacts. In this market there are far more employees than positions, and while it would give everyone warm fuzzies to give personal callbacks for failed interviews, this realistically isn't going to happen. Not calling you, for better or worse, is the de facto standard for most jobs. Also, being disappointed at your lack of experience is not really lacking in courtesy - it's a fair observation that may actually be correct.

If you want a response, call them. No, I'm not being sarcastic, condescending, or facetious. I've opened more doors cold-calling people than any job website or spiffy resume has ever earned me. Differentiate, find out who will be reading your resume (cold calling works wonders here) and pen a cover letter with their name on it. Talk to your interviewer, ask questions, make an impression outside of the interview room. This goes back to the point about differentiation - it makes all the difference in the world (it is worth noting that this works both professionally and romantically ;)). DO NOT treat the job like "yet another job" - for the interviewer that leaves a very bad taste. Failing to be knowledgeable and curious about their work and their company is very bad for this reason - you are communicating that they have yet-another-generic-position-at-generic-company. Showing enthusiasm about what they do, and asking good question, especially pre-interview (e.g., during the job fare) is a very, very good way to make a good impression. It may shock you how few people do this.

Whatever you do, do not treat the job finding process as mechanical - that you toss your resume in one end, follow the handy on-screen instructions, and kablammo! Job! No, it doesn't work that way - every worthwhile job I've ever had has been hard fought and won. Following the "rules" (submit resume, wait for response, go to interview, wait for response) is honestly for suckers, and you'll be one too if you follow it without deviation.

Re: Ask HN: As an employer, what do you wish applicants did more often?

#9
Recently I interviewed roughly twenty candidates for a software development position. There were a handful of recurring things the candidates did that bothered me.

If given a programming problem, don't stand/sit quietly while you work out the solution. Give the interviewer some insight to your thought processes. It would be nice if you could answer the question correctly. What would be best is if you can express to me that you're going to try different approaches to solve a problem when you hit a roadblock.

If you need help and it is offered, take it. Quite a few candidates got very close to the solutions but were too stubborn to accept help when it was offered. That sealed the deal on me not hiring a handful of people.

If you really don't know the answer to a technical question just give it your best shot. Admit that's all you've got and ask the interviewer how he would solve the problem. What I'm looking for in that situation is that you can show me honesty and that you are genuinely interested in learning that which you don't currently understand.

If you wrote your own resume, have it edited and cut down to size by someone completely non technical. Less is more as far as resumes are concerned.

Be prepared to answer ad hoc questions based upon things you put in your resume that you profess to be an expert in. For example, if you put Javascript on your resume instead of just jQuery or some other framework I'm going to ask you about the prototype, variable scope, and closures in the language.

Quite a few candidates just stared blankly near the end of the interview when I asked them if they had any questions for us. Ask questions about the technologies we use and why. Ask us what hard problems we've had to overcome. Engage with us, your future coworkers.

Smile. Be sure to smile.

Re: Ask HN: As an employer, what do you wish applicants did more often?

#10
I interviewed 2 recent college grads about a year ago, and they both had the same problem. Both had a demo they had made (this was for someone to help with OpenGL work), and seemed to be reasonably competent and intelligent.

What I worry about most is whether someone will be easy to work with. I assume most people have made it through the resume sorting process by the time they get to me (I'm just an engineer were I work, we're a small company, the boss did the initial vetting).

They were both so worried about making a good impression, I couldn't get them to open up and talk to me. I couldn't tell if they had a sense of humor, or if they were flexible enough to learn something new quickly, or anything else really.

So, my advice.. BE YOURSELF. Write a resume that reflects who you are, This will make you attractive to people who would want to hire you. When you interview, just BE YOURSELF. If you are goofy, let it show. Talk about your enthusiasms, show that you aren't a cookie cutter job applicant. Stick out...

You don't want to work for someone that doesn't want to hire you, it'll make you miserable. I've had several really cool jobs (911 dispatching software, glass panel cockpit displays, digital music encoding/distribution, designing paper airplanes...), and I got all of them because I went in to the interview knowing that the guy doing the hiring interviewed me because he could think of me as someone he could work with from my resume, and we 'clicked' when we met in person.

Everyone is going to give you a list of things you should/shouldn't do in resumes and interviews, but except for the obviously universal ones (spelling/grammar/personal hygiene...) these lists are full of exceptions and personal taste. Do what YOU think is the right thing, this will innately sell you to the kind of people that you want to work for.

One of my previous bosses is a regular on here, he's probably going to laugh himself silly if he reads this (I wasn't always the best employee once I got hired -- but that's another story...)

Good Luck!

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