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Ask HN: Why does cryptocurrency subjects on HN lack curious conversations?

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Ask HN: Why does cryptocurrency subjects on HN lack curious conversations?

#1
I remember reading about cryptocurrencies on HN around the time Bitcoin was first published. A lot of skepticism was already there, of course. But the discussions were mostly curious, and people trying to learn more, even when they didn't really understand any value of the thing, or when they thought it might be bad.

Contrast that with how the discussions on HN are today, where there are basically two camps that are just screaming at each other. Curious conversations about cryptocurrencies on HN are basically gone, and one group yells how great everything is while the other one is warning of the impeding doom and zero use cases.

Why did it get like this? Is the sentiment similar on other social media? Is there any particular reason cryptocurrencies are so divisive while other subjects are not?

Re: Ask HN: Why does cryptocurrency subjects on HN lack curious conversations?

#3
I think basically because there is nothing interesting left to discus.

One camp (where I am in) basically believes it is an environmental disaster, unsuitable for its stated purpose and most likely as scam by the "whales" manipulating the price, and with a potential 51%-disaster.

The other camp believes that it is the future of money, untraceable wealth storage and inflation/"confiscation proof" and that all the environmental impact is just a temporary problem, that is solved when proof-of-stake is ready (which IMHO will never happen).

The tech itself is quite simple in concept with a few novel key insights in the old days (which by now are generally accepted).

So all in all, it is back to good old politics and do you believe in "it" nor not.

I think that I see in my network of people that the more technically apt they are, the less they believe in it - but I am not sure whether I just project my own skepticism ...

EDIT: typo proof-of-state -> proof-of-stake

Re: Ask HN: Why does cryptocurrency subjects on HN lack curious conversations?

#4
I'm going to attempt an answer, but as with all things this is only my perspective and I obviously don't speak for all HN readers.

HN is largely for founders who want to build things. That's certainly how it started, and there's still traces of that vibe around in the Show HN and startup-y threads. There's a lot more going on here now, like more code topics, AI, electric vehicles, environmental things, a little futurism, etc, but the core is and always has been startups. In itself that doesn't rule out having a reasonable conversation about cryptocurrency. There are a lot of opportunities around crypto. There are startups to found, and pain points to solve. The problem is that crypto has three significant problems for HN readers:

Firstly, a lot of people trying to make a living in crypto are purely speculating. They're not building anything. They're simply trying to "buy low, sell high". Entrepreneurs, in general, don't really have much respect for that. Founders admire and respect people who go out, found a business, and build something real that solves a real problem, even if it's a problem we don't have ourselves. Leeching off the system isn't a skill.

Secondly, a lot of crypto isn't solving a real problem. It's essentially trying to be "digital gold", but without the usefulness of gold. It's only a store of value. There absolutely are good uses for crypto, and even for things like NFTs, but most of the speculation isn't about those things. It's only the "buy low, sell high" side of things. HN is not a forex or trading forum. Again, we respect people who make things.

Lastly, no matter how you cut it, and even with the latest lightning and taproot and proof-of-stake tech considered, crypto has a massive set of problems to still to solve with its environmental, regulatory, and money-laundering issues. To be honest, to me, they look pretty unsolvable. I have a decent understanding of the tech and I can't see how you can build an anonymous system for transferring wealth around that requires significant bandwidth and CPU and not screw the planet by providing a service for drug dealers and terrorists. The fact people are trying is awesome, but I suspect they'll fail. All of the upsides of crypto are also upsides for people who want to use it for bad reasons.

All in all, cryptocurrencies are an interesting idea, and the tech seems like it could have some valid applications, but the downsides are huge. A lot of the pro-crypto people involved don't want to acknowledge that. A lot of the anti-crypto people can't see that the tech could be useful. There's no middle-ground. That makes talking about it pretty boring.

Re: Ask HN: Why does cryptocurrency subjects on HN lack curious conversations?

#6
Appeals to "curious discussion" sound an awful lot like a request to omit any reference to any of the many downsides and known problems and failures of crypto in general, and instead just focus on convenient cheerful angles that pump it up.

It's not possible to have serious, informative, and insightful discussions on a topic like crypto while turning a blind eye to the elephants in the room.

Re: Ask HN: Why does cryptocurrency subjects on HN lack curious conversations?

#7
There’s only so much to be said for retaining my curiosity after years and years of getting shouted about it by people who have no understanding of what they are peddling.

I’m actively involved in the space, I explored my curiosity through designing a few DApps, building some coins, the usual. The tech is interesting, the approach is worthwhile, the whole FOMO pyramid on top of it is just noise and I wish it would stop. I’ve never seen so much nonsense discussions about GSM, GPS or other widely used and useful systems.

When I talk to a crypto peddler, I never have to reach out for my know how as it’s never the case that the discussion progresses past THIS IS THE FUTURE NOW YOU GOTTA JUMP ON BOARD OR ELSE YOU MISS THE MOON TRAIN.

Re: Ask HN: Why does cryptocurrency subjects on HN lack curious conversations?

#9
post #4

I'm going to attempt an answer, but as with all things this is only my perspective and I obviously don't speak for all HN readers. HN is largely for founders who want to build things. That's certainly how it started, and there's still traces of that vibe around in the Show HN and startup-y threads. There's a lot more going on here now, like more code topics, AI, electric vehicles, environmental things, a little futur…

> There absolutely are good uses for crypto, and even for things like NFTs

What do you think are the good uses for crypto and NFTs?

(This is a genuine question; I've never been sure what to think about crypto.)

Re: Ask HN: Why does cryptocurrency subjects on HN lack curious conversations?

#10
> Is there any particular reason cryptocurrencies are so divisive while other subjects are not?

At this day, end 2021, for what concerns the daily life of billion people worldwide, they are still a very small niche for first-world, trading-like unauthorised gambling? From a technical point of view, sufficient progress has been made… it is politics now, geopolitics and environment, if you like, preventing wider, global deployment, maybe?

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