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What is a product?

roge.onwrite.app

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Re: What is a product?

#61
post #9

It’s a great question, but I don’t think the article answers it. Not in any academic sense, but in a real-world sense a software product is something that as a user you can rely on to solve a problem. Rely is doing the heavy lifting in that sentence. You can rely on a vendor’s product if (a) they’re going to be around for a long time, otherwise the investment into adopting it isn’t worth it; (b) the vendor is committ…

A product is much more than the software and its reliability. The business side is just as big of a lift. You need to build a business, not just a product. A business includes understanding the value proposition, not just a potential solution in the form of a tool. It includes understanding how the software fits in to the target customer's workflow, and how it provides real value. You need to be able to communicate that value proposition to the customers, investors and your employees, amongst other stakeholders. Later, this transforms into understanding the sales cycle and how to use marketing to grow your users. The business side has always been the hard part. Software was always easy to build. The hard part is knowing what to build that really provides value.

Re: What is a product?

#62

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yes, I guess I wasn't clear: it's a product if it is exchanged - at all. At any scale. (There was a missing 'any' in my original statement.) You can sell a single product for an enormous price, you can sell 1,000 products at a low price - the only thing that matters is that the two parties agree to conduct the exchange at any scale and, most importantly, that it actually occurs. Common to both high-end scale and low-…

Not sure how that’s helpful in the context of the question the article poses: What is the difference between a vibe coded thing and a “real” product?

Not sure how you're missing it. He's making a distinction between the concept of a Project and a Product. I agree with the distinction and he seems to be saying that the author has the wrong concept of what a product is but to answer your parent comment is saying that there's no difference between a vibe coded thing and a 'real' product so long as there has been some satisfactory transfer of agency and an exchange between user and product creator at any scale. So he's essentially saying that the author may be conflating vibe coded PROJECT (with a vibe coded PRODUCT) and that if so comparing a vibe coded PROJECT with any 'real' (whatever that means) product is an unfair comparison and on the flip side if they're comparing vive coded PRODUCT with a real PRODUCT then they're one and the same thing from the perspective that there was an transfer of agency and utility has been exchanged between user and product creator. I happen to agree with parent comment. It's an airtight argument that it doesn't matter how yu made it. The distinction between vibe coded and 'real' product is fuzzy at best. The real distinction lies between a PROJECT and a PRODUCT.

Re: What is a product?

#64
post #41

I agree with the point generally but: > I haven't seen any real competitor of YouTube, or Figma, or Google, or Instagram created solely with AI. Is a ridiculous set of products to expect competitors for. First all but 1 rely heavily on network effects. YouTube is a low cost provider. Think about it, they provide unlimited high quality video storage for free. They process 500 hours of content every minute. Google and…

Yeah, I agree that YouTube, Instagram, and so on are a high bar. Not even the people who created these companies twenty years ago would be able to replicate the success of these products. My goal with this article was to highlight the hidden complexities behind any meaningful product. For example, how will I store the user info and settings? What if the user regrets buying my product? What if it is too complex? Who are the target users? And so on. Many questions that no single prompt can satisfactorily give us answers to without putting real thought into the thing, and none of this is shown in the demos we see around. Anyway, I loved all the insights I got here. Thanks for taking your time to write a reply.

Re: What is a product?

#66
post #64
post #41

I agree with the point generally but: > I haven't seen any real competitor of YouTube, or Figma, or Google, or Instagram created solely with AI. Is a ridiculous set of products to expect competitors for. First all but 1 rely heavily on network effects. YouTube is a low cost provider. Think about it, they provide unlimited high quality video storage for free. They process 500 hours of content every minute. Google and…

Yeah, I agree that YouTube, Instagram, and so on are a high bar. Not even the people who created these companies twenty years ago would be able to replicate the success of these products. My goal with this article was to highlight the hidden complexities behind any meaningful product. For example, how will I store the user info and settings? What if the user regrets buying my product? What if it is too complex? Who a…

I also think you under appreciate the value of toy software. We’ve spent 20 years talking about serious practices for making serious software but what if the next 20 years is about making personal toys that scratch our own itch? Perhaps LLMs fill this need quite well and they aren’t suppose to replicate what already exists.

Re: What is a product?

#67
Maybe what these llms open up is the ability to create personal tools to get xyz job done, rather than creating companies with polished products. Perhaps for the latter you'd still need some combination of team, timing, etc.

But the question of should I spin up my own website in a few minutes or use wordpress for my blog is now open. Your personal tools can compete with what's out there and you may decide what you build in one session is more compelling than what the "pros" are offering.

And for personal tools you are much more forgiving for the mistakes if it gets whatever task you want done.

Re: What is a product?

#69
post #41

I agree with the point generally but: > I haven't seen any real competitor of YouTube, or Figma, or Google, or Instagram created solely with AI. Is a ridiculous set of products to expect competitors for. First all but 1 rely heavily on network effects. YouTube is a low cost provider. Think about it, they provide unlimited high quality video storage for free. They process 500 hours of content every minute. Google and…

OpenAI tried to create a Instagram competitor and failed miserably
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